Dan Hughes on Avoiding Burnout While Building Wealth

This transcript is auto-generated and lightly edited for readability, it may contain errors.

[00:18] Sammie Ellard-King:

So, Dan, welcome to the Money Gains Podcast. How are you? Thank you. It’s good to be here. Thank you. I think for a bit of context, where you know each other a little bit, I’ve been coming to some of your sessions, which we’re going to get on to very shortly. But I just want to say, first off, thank you for everything you’ve done because it has actually changed my entire life, I think.

SPEAKER_03: Wow, that’s a big statement.

SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it is a big statement. And I think to set the context for today, I think we want to talk a little bit about health as well as wealth, but also like purpose in life as well.

SPEAKER_01: Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: And I’d love for you to bring us up to speed a little bit about what you do and some of your story as well.

SPEAKER_03: Okay, so um essentially I I started my own business um about 16 months ago with my wife. Um, and I I came from quite a heavy-duty corporate background uh initially. Um, but I was very, very ill in uh February 2021, and that really um set a whole series of dominoes starting to fall, really. Um and here I am now running a business. Uh I am a Wim Hof method instructor, but I’m also uh an oxygen advantage advanced breathwork coach. Now this was way outside what you know what I what I used to know, um, but I discovered, you know, by default really, that uh that breath work and getting cold were the things that were gonna make me better. Um and and and you know, when I was at my lowest in in the in that sort of middle part of 2021, it was those things that you know that started to to I started to realise that that that was what was going to get me through this.

[02:02] Sammie Ellard-King:

Just talk to us a little bit about before that.

SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so my my medical history is quite complicated. Um I I had cancer in my late 30s, which I’d fully recovered from. Um, but that you know, that left my immune system compromised. So any bug that the kids came home with, I was the first to catch, you know, flus, coughs, colds, anything. Um and of course, when COVID came along, I was particularly concerned. I was doing a lot of travelling with my with my job at that time. Um, and sure enough, you know, caught COVID like most of us did in 2021. Uh I did my 10 days at home, you know, testing every day as we as we do. It seems like a long distant memory now.

SPEAKER_02: It’s wild, isn’t it?

SPEAKER_03: Um and I um eventually I I um uh I was well enough to go back to work and uh jumped on a plane almost immediately. I was back in the office and uh a couple of days later flew down to the Middle East and collapsed in a hotel bathroom. Uh and I was there for for quite some time before anybody realised what was going on. Um and to be perfectly honest with you, I never fully recovered from that. I got home, soldiered on as we do, carried on working hard, carried on, you know, trying to function normally. You went back to work. I went back to work, yeah. But but because I just thought it was a virus, I just sort of picked up something, you know, on the plane or whatever. Yeah. Um, and I I never fully recovered from it. And it got worse and worse and worse. And I went into the office on one one day, five or six weeks after I’d got back from the Middle East, and I genuinely couldn’t remember who it was I was supposed to meet. Um, I’d met them a thousand times before, I’d met them in the same building a thousand times before. I genuinely couldn’t remember who they were. Oh, you went memories? Completely complete brain fog.

[03:51] Sammie Ellard-King:

Wow.

SPEAKER_03: Anyway, the lots of other symptoms um thrown into the mix. Um insomnia, you know, a good day was getting from the bed to the sofa, you know, really bad fatigue, um, pins and needles in my hand so much so that I couldn’t pick anything up, um, couldn’t see properly, just awful. And I, you know, I went into a bit of a hole from a mental health point of view because I thought rewinding the clock going back to that, you know, that that point in my late 30s. Anyway, I I um I signed up for a lot of um a lot of research programs into long COVID because the doctor was beginning to talk to me about the fact that he thought it may have been long COVID. So I signed up to lots of research programs, and one of the things one of those research programs um brought to light was that non-sleep deep rest, NSDR, um, was a really good thing to do just to calm yourself down. So I was anxious about the fact that I wasn’t working, I wasn’t, you know, supporting the team that that relied on me, you know, I was letting people down, all those things were floating through my head all the time, all the time I was sat on the sofa unable to do anything, couldn’t think straight. Um, but they were they were, you know, they were worrying me. Um, and I discovered that this resting and just focusing on my breathing, nothing else, was having an effect. I didn’t quite know what it was, but I just felt different afterwards, put it that way. Uh, and then one of my symptoms was getting really, really hot for no apparent reason, a real hot flush. Um, so taking myself upstairs and having a cold shower, again, I was beginning to feel a little bit different. And it wasn’t until a good friend of mine put me in in touch with a book and said, You’ve got to read this book by a Dutchman called Wim Hof, that I realised that I was practicing two of the three pillars of the Wim Hof method: breathwork and cold exposure. Did some research, started to enjoy understanding a bit more about the power of the breath and the power of the cold. Uh, and eventually I got to the point where I decided I needed a focus for my mind. My mind was going to mush. I decided that I would um follow the online training course and just, you know, just see if I could get to the end of the training course, just so that I had a purpose every day. Yeah. Get up, couple of hours of study, and just start getting my brain working again. Um, and that’s what I did. And then that, you know, that went to the next level once I’d passed the online training course to then sign myself up for the practical training course and got a mentor who was also a Wim Hof method instructor and you know, built up my knowledge and understanding, uh, and then went and did my um final assessment, practical assessments, um, and became a qualified Wim Hof method instructor. This was all still with the thought in my mind that I was going to go back to work full-time, go back straight back into the job that they very kindly held open for me. Um, and it wasn’t until I had to make a decision. You know, I was well enough. My doctor said, Look, I think you can go back to work. I said, I agree, I definitely can. Um, and uh because I wanted to go back earlier, by the way. I’d wanted to go back to work much, much earlier. And the doctor said to me, I’ve seen this happen too many times to allow you to go back to work too early. You’ll crash and burn. You’ll be back where you are, you know, back where you were six months ago. Um, so the time came for me to make the decision to go back to work, and I thought, actually, do I really want to go back into a full-time corporate job with all the you know, all the stress and anxiety of a big job, or should I do something that’s way more fulfilling, way more worthwhile, and start to promote and teach this stuff to other people to help them get better. So I took that decision.

[07:53] Sammie Ellard-King:

Amazing.

SPEAKER_03: Um, and then after I’d after I’d uh taken that decision, I then decided that actually Wim Hof method instructing was was probably not enough. I wanted to do something else, hence the oxygen advantage training as well. Wow. So yeah, so quite you know, quite a convoluted story, but um that’s how I ended up here, you know, working for myself with with my wife as as a business partner. Um uh she she’s been in the health and well-being space for a long time, so it was a natural progression for her. Um but um yeah, to go from to go from that, you know, that that full-time salary job into self-employment is um is quite a challenge. Oh but it’s you know, it it was the right thing to do. I I genuinely feel that I’ve now got a purpose. Love that for you. Thank you.

[08:47] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah, it’s it’s amazing. But I think this happened to you obviously because of your health, and you know, that can happen to anyone. Um, but it can also happen to people that have been burning the candle at both ends and working so hard, you know, 6 a.m. train into the city or wherever you work, or you know, whatever that might well be, and just really burning yourself so hard until you are forced to have a reset. And that can actually be so damaging.

SPEAKER_03: I 100% agree. Do you know? I was on the train early this morning coming up up here, and I had five people in my vision, and four of those five people were breathing through their mouth. They were already in a stress state before they’d even got off the train and started their job. On the phone, you know, neck down, breathing through the mouth, or you know, asleep with their mouth open. Scary. You know, a lot of people are not realising the the damage that that not breathing properly can do, and they’re they’re setting themselves into that state of heightened alert, that heightened state, uh, you know, before they’ve even started. Yeah. Um, and that’s just gonna cumulatively affect, um, you know, have a cumulative effect as their day progresses. Um, but your point about health and wealth that you said right at the start, really, you know, I really got some insight when I was not working, how important your health is. Because without your health, you can’t be a dad, you can’t be a husband, you can’t be a partner, you can’t be a mate, you know, you can’t be part of the social circle because you’re you know, you’re you’re not well. You just everything we start with. Everything falls apart. Yeah.

[10:33] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah. It’s like your entire life. And when those things happen to you, like I, you know, I uh really open, I could you know it being a founder of a growing business takes its toll. And I was doing exactly that seven days a week, you know, 16 hour days, just going for it. Got out of shape, um, you know, relationships started to fall apart, didn’t see my family enough, didn’t see my friends, and all because I was like just drilled for so focused on this mission. And it was actually when I first met you that we f I first got introduced to the Wim Hof methods. I saw a marked change in me in that day, but I went home, carried on, etc. etc. And it was only really in sort of January time that it sort of really started to manifest. Um and it really does make you think like, what are we actually doing all of this for? I think it stems over into your money conversation as well, because like, you know, what are you investing for? What are you actually working so hard? Like, do you want to be that CEO that you’re turning up to be every single day because that’s the pathway that you’re leading? Um and if you haven’t got the back end sorted out, all none of that matters really, because you and you’ll get a wake-up call at some point. And it’ll happen to you in your 20s or your 50s, yeah, or your 60s or whatever, that it’s gonna happen to you at some point. Um if you haven’t got that right.

[12:03] Dan Hughes:

Yeah, I I totally agree. And I think also that if you are, you know, if you are working towards burnout, if you are stressed all the time, unable to sleep and not eating properly and working too hard, then you know, you’re not gonna be making the right decisions. And those include the decisions that that you talk about in terms of you know, wealth and investment and all that, all the financial decisions, as well as everything else. So you’re quite right. You you know, you almost need to rewind the clock right back and start, you know, start with the basics, get the basics right, and then everything else will will follow. I say in my workshops and courses all the time that the mind controls the body, but the breath controls the mind. So if you get control of your breath, you control your mind, everything else will flow.

[12:51] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah, it is really, really powerful stuff. And yeah, we’re gonna do some today. Uh but I do want to just sort of heart back a touch because I think the context, like, what did you do?

SPEAKER_03: So, okay, that yeah, that’s a I’ve talked about this career, but but not talked about what it was I did. So I worked um initially for um an international marina company, so parking places for boats basically, but on a on an international basis. Um so we were uh we were operating facilities around the world that enable people to keep their keep their boats safe. Um yachts and things. Yachts and things, yeah, yachts, power, power boat, super yachts. Uh and then we um we were getting because because the brand that I worked for was the best known brand in in the business, um, I um uh I was getting a lot of inquiries from people that wanted us to set up a marina facility for them, design it for them, and and so on. And we had no we had no ability to do that. So I created a consultancy business where we would take those projects, we would do the design, and then those projects were then fed into our operating business. So we would operate and brand the facility as well. And that was really successful. Lots of travel, um, you know, very different working environments in every different location, different culture, different business culture as well. Really interesting to learn, you know, how to do business in Italy versus how to do business in the Middle East versus how to do business in the Caribbean. Um, and that was that was absolutely fascinating. And I I really enjoyed that part of the role. Um, and then I was uh I was headhunted and and I moved to uh the Goodwood estate down in in West Sussex, yeah, uh, where I ran the consultancy business for Goodwood. So everything that we did on the estate in Goodwood, I I would help deliver off the estate. And we did lots of really cool stuff. Yeah, we did some work with the Henry Ford Museum in Detroit. We did work for um the Saudi government designing motorsport theme parks. We had projects all over the, you know, all over the world, all over the place.

[15:03] Sammie Ellard-King:

So safe to say a pretty highly stressful, powerful role.

SPEAKER_03: Very much so. Yeah, very much so. With a with a really strong brand sat behind you as well. So you had to deliver to the standard of the brand all the time. And it had to be on top form.

SPEAKER_02: And dealing internationally, you’re then dealing with time zones, you’re getting emails at 2 a.m. Yeah. Often urgent.

SPEAKER_03: Yeah. My my my day would you know would would start um sort of 5 a.m. and probably not finish until 10 30, 11 o’clock because of the time zone situation. And the same in the in the marina business as well. I used to commute to London and I’d be on the phone to my colleagues uh, you know, in the in the uh in the sort of eastern time zone um, you know, first thing in the morning and then in the in the western time zone in the in the evening. Crazy.

[15:50] Sammie Ellard-King:

So knowing what you know now, was it worth it? All of that hard work and stress to get to your point that you are today?

[16:45] Dan Hughes:

That’s a really difficult question to answer. Was it worth it? Um I don’t get me wrong, I really enjoyed what I did. It was, you know, it was an interesting job, and it it was way, way more interesting than than I realise a lot of other people, you know, are faced with when it when it comes to work. Um but I was working for shareholders, so you know, making potentially, you know, potentially wealthy people even more wealthy, whilst I slowly killed myself. So so that is probably not worth it, is it?

SPEAKER_02: No. That’s what I was getting at, because like you’ve got to this point, you’ve had that aha moment happen to me. And I feel like unless you’re working for somewhere where the mission is like ingrained into your psyche and being, you know, 99% of the people in this country and around the world, that isn’t the case. You’re just doing it because you’re there, it’s can eventually it will eventually will start to like take its toll in its health, but also in your mind as well. Yes. And I feel like that’s why I asked that question. Because everyone that I’ve met that’s gone, oh yeah, and then they move over and do the do the thing have gone no, but yes. Because I think it it’s very important to like not completely discount all the work you’ve done up to this point, and because it’s made you the person that you are today.

[18:13] Dan Hughes:

Yes. But it’s also all the lessons that I learned all the way through have set me well for creating a new business. So I’m very brand aware, I’m very structured in how I put things together, very professional in the way I deliver things. You know, I’ve stood in front of senior leaders of of you know of um of government presenting, you know, and pitching. So I know how to engage with an audience, at least I think I do. Um, and um, you know, all those lessons that I’ve learned going through my career have you know start are starting to play out now. Um so yes, you know, that that experience is is sat there in the background.

SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think because when people have like initially come to look at say a business idea, they’re like, well, I don’t know how anything. I’m like, well, you you do. You actually know a lot more than you think you do. And I think people are so hard on themselves when they come to that situation. And it’s like, well, actually, if you’ve done a customer service role in call centres, well, great, you know how to talk to angry people. Big part of the thing is like being able to like stay calm in those situations. It’s a massive part in business, staying calm in stressful situations because it will happen. And there’s tons of things in there, you know, dealing with a team, being part of a team, teamwork, understanding management. If you’ve moved into management, like how do you deal with people? Um, and these are all things and skills which are going to be very powerful for you when you go and do your own thing, if you go and do your own thing.

[19:40] Dan Hughes:

Totally agree, totally agree. And and, you know, uh if if you’ve had the the opportunity, like I did, to create, you know, business plan after business plan for other people when it comes to doing your own, you you kind of know what what you’re looking for.

SPEAKER_02: Yeah, totally. So if someone’s listening to this right now and they’re thinking, yeah, you know, uh they’ve got that kind of gut feeling that they’re kind of meant to do something else and they didn’t ever set out to work in account management or, you know, hospitality or whatever that might well be, like what’s some core things that they can start to look at to really start to change the way that they think about this.

SPEAKER_03: Your reference to gut instinct is really interesting. There’s a recent study um done. I can’t remember the the uh the precise details of who did the study, but they suggest that your subconscious brain can deal with 300 million thoughts a second. 300 million. 300 million your your conscious mind can only cope with about 2,000, which is still quite a lot every second. So those people that have that feel that they’ve got an idea but they’re not sure what that idea is, they know they want to do something, then ask your subconscious to help you. And you can use a breathing exercise that helps your s helps your creativity.

[21:01] Sammie Ellard-King:

Okay.

SPEAKER_03: And we’ll we’ll go through that breathing exercise shortly. But the idea is that you plant the seed in your subconscious, you allow that seed to cultivate, and it will bring you the answer. It will bring you. It works. It works, it is remarkable. Okay. And and many of us have have had that situation where we’ve been out, you know, maybe gone for a run or gone for a walk or sat on the beach, not really thinking about anything, and all of a sudden the answer will come. So something you didn’t think you knew, you know, you didn’t think you were thinking about.

SPEAKER_02: That’s what they say, the best idea is in the shower, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: So that is your that’s your gut instinct, your subconscious working on your behalf. So for those people that listening that perhaps know that they need to do something, they want to get get out of the you know the the the circle that they’re in, just plant the seed in your subconscious and see what happens. And it’s very easy because all you need to do is is sit yourself down in a nice quiet room, just close your eyes and really focus on your breath. Don’t change anything, but just notice your breath. And do that for a few minutes and then when you think you’ve had enough, do it for a few minutes more, and then ask your subconscious to help you. Say, you know, say in the words, I would like some help with my idea and leave it at that. Then just just bring your consciousness back to the you know, back to the forefront of your mind and and the answer will usually come. It might take a couple of days, might take a couple of weeks, but the answer will usually come. So can we do this? What what do we do? So we just it’s not gonna make very good podcast material because it’s very quiet breathing. So all you literally do is just sit. Quietly in a room, close your eyes and literally just focus on your breath just for a few minutes. And then when you think you’ve you know had enough, you just reset and and do do it for a few minutes more and then ask your subconscious the question. And for you what’s a good breath. So a good breath is always in through the nose. And a nice long exhale. So we’ll do we’ll do some more, you know, some more sort of structured breath exercises for everybody to practice as as we go through this chat. But the the the key to dialing down or switching on, if you like, your parasympathetic nervous system, your rest and digest nervous system, which is the one you want to be in most of the time, is to extend your exhale. So if you breathe in through your nose and then either extend your exhale out through your nose or through your mouth, pursed lips, that is immediately going to switch on your parasympathetic nervous system.

[23:43] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: Um, and all those guys that I was witnessing on the train today, they’re all breathing through their mouth, very high, you know, up in the chest, very shallow, very fast breathing. Um now, you know, a good breath rate when you’re at rest is about six breaths a minute. So if you if you think about it, five seconds of inhale, five seconds of exhale is ten seconds times six, six times, six times a minute. That’s a that’s a really good breath. When you are breathing at that rate, your body systems are all in harmony with each other. Your heart rate is in harmony with your respiratory rate, and all your body systems are working, you know, as they should do. They’re all getting the right amount of oxygen and what have you.

[24:29] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah, like harping back to before like we came, I came to see you in January, was like that I was like mouth breathing throughout the day. And uh, you know, this is useful for anyone that’s sort of working, was that you would get I’d get that like brain fog. It’s like that typical after lunch, would have to have a coffee or tea to get me through that period. And even in that period, I would never book calls, I would never like do any deep work just because I physically wasn’t like actually mentally able to. And that got worse and worse and worse and was growing and growing and growing until it was like six hours of the day, which was massively impacting like how you live. And so I think it’s like massive beneficial for founders, but anyone and any sort of work, like calming yourself down, will make you focus better, make you sleep better. There’s so many benefits.

[25:22] Dan Hughes:

Absolutely. Focus, concentration, sleep, energy. Um, you know, there are so many benefits. And it and it’s such a simple thing. We we were all born into this world breathing exactly as we should do. As if you watch a baby breathe, the the perfect breather, in and out through the nose, belly is pumping, you know, that’s where the that’s where the breath motor is is working at its best. The diaphragm is is really key. And and we teach ourselves the path of least resistance and begin to breathe through our mouth too much. Um, and we’ve we’ve all witnessed that that moment where we’re looking at our phone and then you suddenly take us you know a big gulp of air in because we’ve stopped breathing. So we’re we’re not only breathing incorrectly and heightening our state, but then we’re dropping our oxygen levels significantly by not breathing. Um, you know, when we’re looking at our phones or or responding to an email. So you you’ve got to, you know, you have got to consciously think about this stuff to start with. But the brain is so clever that it it very quickly realises that when you’re breathing in the right way, that is more beneficial for it and your body, and therefore it slowly trains you to breathe the way it wants you to breathe. Yeah. Which is remarkable. I love it.

[26:39] Sammie Ellard-King:

I me too. Uh I can’t wait to to do some of today, actually. But I um what happens if you continue down that path? If you aren’t breathing correctly, and you Yeah, because everyone’s like, oh yeah, but you know, obviously you breathe. I I I get that quite a lot when I talk about this. Yeah. And I’m like, yeah, well, of course you do, but you don’t breathe correctly. So what happens to you if you don’t for a long period of time?

SPEAKER_03: So if you don’t, you you you set yourself on a on a uh you know a downward spiral. Um so your your body works in a heightened state all the time. So you’re you’re full of adrenaline, full of cortisol, um, stress hormones, basically. As a result of that, your um the rest of your body function starts to slow down. So so everything from your athletic ability through to um your cognitive ability, um, even things like um sexual performance are affected by stress levels. So testosterone lowered basically, or well, your body’s in a heightened state. So when your body’s in that heightened state, fight or flight mode, your all your body is telling you to do is to run away, you know, is to run away from that saber-toothed tiger that’s that’s chasing you. That’s where the you know that innate um that innate response comes from. And when you’re in that heightened state, all the other systems in your body shut down. So um I in my late 30s, I um, as I said, I I was diagnosed and treated for cancer. I had colon cancer. I am 100% convinced that I had that colon cancer because my life was too stressful. I was operating in a in a heightened state. Um my marriage was breaking down, you know, everything was going wrong, I couldn’t, you know, I couldn’t do the things that I wanted to do well, you know, my exercise routines had all gone out the window. Everything was a shambles and a mess, and you know, I was in a in a complete mess. And I am absolutely convinced that that’s what allowed that particular disease to get hold of me. So when you’re in that heightened state, all those systems stop working correctly and efficiently, and you open yourself up to illness and and disease. Um, so it’s a it’s a really it’s a really important thing to get a hold of. Yeah, because it’s gonna it’s not just personal, it’s everything, isn’t it?

[30:27] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01: Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: Wow. That’s so crazy. And people think this stuff is gonna take them ages, but it doesn’t, does it?

SPEAKER_03: It really doesn’t. No, it really doesn’t. And and it it might sound a little bit woo-woo, but there’s a huge amount of science that sits behind it. Yeah, and that’s what I’m interested in, is that you know, there are numerous studies around that show, you know, show that just some very simple breath techniques have a dramatic impact on, you know, all the things that we should be able to do.

SPEAKER_02: I uh uh you know, I’m l I do it every day now, every morning. Um and it it has changed everything. It’s changed everything. And it’s just I was that guy that would like go zero to one hundred, but I wouldn’t like it wouldn’t be outbursts from it, it’s internal about like the smallest thing. Um and that would stay with me for 15, 20 minutes and would probably happen, you know, 10, 15 times a day. And then you add that up, that’s two, three hours of height and stress. And my whoop uh with the data is a testament to that. If you look back at last year, like majority of the day is spent medium to high stress. But with the breath work, I now sit sort of most of the day medium, but some sometimes in the low section of my stress levels. And it’s the breath work with and of uh and the cold exposure, which we’ll we’ll get on to as well, which I think has sort of really turned that around.

[32:07] Dan Hughes:

Yeah, yeah. I think it it it’s important to differentiate the between bad stress and good stress. So actually, bad stress is all the stuff we’ve been talking about, that you know, the the ridiculous hours of work, the constant communication, you know, the fact that our brains are getting sucked into stuff all the time.

SPEAKER_02: Social media, WhatsApp, etc.

SPEAKER_03: Yeah, all that sort of thing is is you know is creating that heightened stress. Bad inverted, commas, bad stress. Good stress is um is necessary. So putting yourself into an ice bath on a regular basis is a good stress. You’re teaching your body to adapt, you’re teaching your body to stay switched on, um, but it’s um you know, but but it’s encouraging your body to adapt to stress in a different way. And therefore, the the the delta, if you like, between you know being super relaxed and super stressed becomes you know, starts to decrease the more and more you put good stress into your life. So breath work is a good stress as well because you are increasing um, you’re sorry, you’re you’re decreasing carbon dioxide levels in your blood, which your body doesn’t particularly like. It thinks it’s in a high oxygen, sorry, a high altitude environment and therefore produces more red blood cells to help you cope with delivering oxygen around your body. So all these things that that you’re now doing are putting good stress or hormetic stress into your body, which is a really beneficial thing. Get rid of all the bad stuff, keep the good stuff.

[33:40] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah, and I I like doing it in the morning because then it sets you for the day.

SPEAKER_03: Makes you feel powerful, right?

SPEAKER_02: Does it honestly is like having an energy drink at like first thing in the morning, but sustained for a long period of time. And those little moments where I used to go zero to 100 internally just don’t happen as much. You know, it still happens because you know stuff stresses you out, and it’s life, right? Yeah, life’s hard, and yeah, we’ve got to be aware of that. But it’s the little tiny things now. I’m just like, oh, whatever. And I I I find that that’s such made one such a difference to my life, but equally as well, the impact on the level of work and the quality of work that I can actually get done is phenomenally different. And I just see things a lot more clearer, and yeah, I think it’s such an easy thing to put into your day. Um, so you do it before you leave bed, right? Yeah.

[34:36] Dan Hughes:

Yeah. So the first thing, you know, as soon as I wake up is is I do three or four rounds of of breath work.

SPEAKER_02: And what’s a round of breath work?

SPEAKER_03: So a round of breath work for me is 30 or 40 full in breath through my nose, filling up my belly and then my chest. And then allowing that air to escape. So 30 or 40 minutes, just letting it out with no force, just a really nice relaxed exhale. Okay. So 30 or 40 of those.

SPEAKER_02: So do it, guys. Do all the way.

SPEAKER_03: It’s very difficult to do sat up, actually. It’s much easier to do lying down. So no force on the exhale, really important. And then after 30 or 40 of those breaths, I take my final exhale and I hold my breath empty for 30, 40, 50 seconds, depending on you know how how well I feel, uh, and then take a recovery breath in and hold full for 10, 15 seconds. Let that breath go and start all over again.

[35:38] Sammie Ellard-King:

Okay.

SPEAKER_03: Um, so um you have to be very careful with this exercise if you are epileptic, if you are pregnant, uh, if you have heart condition, high blood pressure. Um, so please don’t do this if you’re, you know, fall into any of those categories. Loads of information on on our website about you know, about the safety aspect of it. But what that what that breath is doing, and I do three or four rounds of that, is um is putting my body, well, first of all, you know, really oxygenating my my body. So I’m 100% oxygenated. Um and then during that breath hold time, my blood carbon dioxide levels begin to creep up. And it’s that blood carbon dioxide level that is the trigger to breathe. So by by forcefully uh breathing lots of air in and then allowing that breath to escape, my blood carbon dioxide level is really low. And slowly, slowly it starts to rebuild as I’m holding my breath. Uh, and that rebuilding of carbon dioxide level sets off a whole sequence of processes in the body, including the production of more red blood cells. So your oxygen carrying capacity is vastly increased, which is why things like focus and concentration improve by following this breath work. Um, because you’re you’re you’ve got much more ability to get oxygen delivered to where it needs to get to. And again, your body is so blooming clever, the first place it delivers oxygen to is your brain. Um, so there’s a lovely little exercise we can do now, actually, in terms of in terms of getting oxygen to your brain. It’s so simple. Okay. So if you’ve got something you really need to concentrate on, you know, you’ve got 20 minutes of something, you know, something that really requires 100% focus.

[37:23] Sammie Ellard-King:

Port, key, mail, letter.

SPEAKER_03: Yeah, whatever. Yeah. Investment decision.

SPEAKER_02: Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: Smart. Put your finger under your nose, take your breath, normal breath in through your nose, and then make your out breath as gentle and as soft and as low as you can across your finger out through your nose. So you can barely feel the air moving across your nose. And then when you need to, take that next breath in. Really slowing that breath right down so you can barely feel it. You know, the hairs in your nostrils hardly moving, barely feel the air drifting across your finger. Now, what you’re doing there is you are um you are telling your body um you’re allowing that carbon dioxide level to to increase in your blood, which is why why it can get a little bit uncomfortable. You feel a little bit of air hunger, like you need to take that next breath in. All that is is the carbon dioxide level in your blood starting to increase. And as a result of that carbon dioxide level in your blood increasing, science lesson coming up. Okay. Warning. The only way oxygen can release itself from the red blood cells that are carrying it around the body is if the carbon dioxide level in your blood is at the right level. It’s called the Bohr effect. My wife thinks the bohr effect is me sat in a chair talking about breathing, actually. But um, the bohr effect is is all about how oxygen detaches itself from red blood cells. Okay. And it can only do that if the carbon dioxide level in your blood is is at the right level.

[39:09] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: If it’s too low, i.e., if you’re mouth breathing all the time, all that happens is that oxygen latches onto the red blood cell, travels around your body, gets back to your lungs and is breathed back out again through your mouth. So all those people on the train mouth breathing, taking breaths in, but you know, a large proportion of the oxygen they’re taking in is not getting to where it needs to get to in the body. If you are keeping control of your carbon dioxide level in your blood, that oxygen can detach itself from the red blood cell wherever it’s needed. Oh, interesting. So by doing that little exercise we’ve just done, we’ve very, you know, and you need to do that for 90 seconds or so. Okay. Um, is is we are very slowly increasing the carbon dioxide level in the in the blood. And when the carbon dioxide level increases, more oxygen can be released from the red blood cells. So carbon dioxide, everyone thinks is a is a waste gas. It is a waste gas because it’s produced, you know, as a result of body systems, but it is also um absolutely essential for getting oxygen delivered around the body. Wow.

[40:16] Sammie Ellard-King:

So if you’re coming up something really important, 90 seconds of that. 90 seconds I set you right up.

SPEAKER_03: You know, Sammie, the advantage of the exercises that I’m gonna show you, including that on, is you can do that anywhere. No one will think anything of it. Yeah, you just sit, you just sit there with your finger under your nose, just focusing on how you’re breathing. You can be looking at a screen, you can be looking at a book. As long as you are putting your full focus on that exhale and making sure it’s as slow and as relaxed and as soft and as calming as you possibly can. That’s really going to help give your brain an extra shot of oxygen.

SPEAKER_02: Wow, so interesting, isn’t it? The science behind it is just hard to argue with, isn’t it, really?

SPEAKER_03: It it is. You know, there the it a all of the things that I uh coach and teach is scientifically proven. I I won’t go down the route of not understanding it myself. Um and you know, there there is no doubt that that um, you know, like like you say, a lot of people say to me, Well, I’ve been breathing for 50 years, it’s dumbly alright, I’m still here. Yeah, but but but when you know how to breathe properly, the difference it makes to your life is remarkable, absolutely remarkable. And you you’ve you know your testament to that by by saying that it has changed your life, and that’s a big statement to make.

[41:33] Sammie Ellard-King:

I think I’m just more conscious as well. Like, you know, like I now know that when I’m out and about, I’ll catch myself and like close your mouth, and it just actually immediately breathed easier and just like okay, I’m more calm, or alert. And it just it has such a big difference.

SPEAKER_03: If you think about, you know, if you think about um why the nose is there, you know, we’d we’re not supposed to eat through our nose, so why are you breathing through your mouth? Your nose is there to breathe. It there are 30 functions associated with the with breathing through your nose that are directly linked to health and well-being. So things like filtering the air of pathogens, humidifying the air, temperature controlling the air, um, you know, removing um removing uh dust and you know all the nasties that are floating around, particularly in cities. So if you are breathing all that in through your mouth, it’s going straight down into your lungs. Um and you know, things like asthma and and you know respiratory diseases are exacerbated by mouth breathing. Um so so if you are, you know, if you are able to to to get your nose back to where it’s supposed to go, it’s gonna make a huge difference.

[42:47] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah, I I love it. You mentioned NSDR earlier, non-sleep deep rests. Um I’ve been doing that for probably about a year. Um, but I utilize it when I’ve had a really bad night of sleep. And so if I’ve not slept correctly, I’ll do the 10, 20 minute Andrew Huberman protocol, which is just insane. And it it’s like you’re floating when you’re doing it, and then after, it’s like you’ve had like a deep two, three hour nap and you’re just back in the game. And this can be really useful for people because it’s like the 10-minute one’s even greatest, it really works. 20 minutes is a little bit more powerful, but like you can do that on a lunch break if you’re like, you know, kids really stressed out, not sleeping correctly, take yourself away, little quiet room, 10 minutes, and you you are back in the game, and it is really, really life-changing.

[43:42] Dan Hughes:

Yeah, uh you can do it anywhere, actually. You know, if if if you uh sat on the, you know, sat on the train, you know, sat on the sofa watching TV, what you know, what whatever the circumstance is, that that’s a really useful exercise. But but the key part of that exercise is breathing is breathing. Yeah. So it, you know, all these things all hook back all hook back to the breath. But interesting that you talk about doing that when you have a a bad night’s sleep. Um you know, I think one of the things that um that that I I coach is how to get a better night’s sleep through through your breath as well. Um, and actually focusing on uh focusing on the fact that you’ve had a bad night’s sleep is not necessarily the best thing to do. The best thing to do is to focus on how you’re gonna sleep the following night and set everything in motion, ready to make sure you sleep well the next night. Um we all have bad nights. You know, I had a uh a bad night um before the before the weekend, um, you know, with with my mother needed an emergency uh A&E appointment. So, you know, very disturbed night sleep, um, you know, lots of thoughts racing through my mind, and and I didn’t sleep well at all. So I just focused my attention on making sure I put into play everything I needed to to sleep well the following day. Okay. Um so um so yeah, that don’t don’t worry about the odd night, you know, the odd night where you have to sleep well. If it’s if it’s habitual and you are, you know, you’re not sleeping properly because you are stressed, you need to deal with that. If you are not breathing correctly during rest, when the demand on your body is low, then you have no chance at all of making sure you breathe properly when the demand is high. So in those heightened stress moments or in during exercise, if you are not breathing as you should do, uh when you’re resting, you’ve got no hope in those states of kind of heightened awareness. That’s great. And one of the best ways to train your body to breathe well is to train it at night when you don’t have to think about it. And you if you take a 24 hour period and you manage to get six or seven or eight hours of really good breathing into play in that period when you’re lying flat on your back, then you know you you’re you’re you’re way ahead of most other people. And the best way to do that is to tape your mouth closed.

[46:09] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yes.

SPEAKER_03: So if you breathe through your mouth now, just very gently and put the tongue put your tongue to the roof of your mouth, notice where your breath goes immediately. It goes straight to your nose. Yeah? Now just close your mouth and notice where your tongue is top of the mouth. Top of the mouth. So all that mouth taping is doing is keeping your mouth closed, keep your tongue in its parking place overnight at the roof of your mouth and therefore you breathe through your nose all night. Your tongue doesn’t slide to the back of your throat so you don’t snore. You won’t be waking yourself up with little sleep apneas where you you know subconsciously or consciously gasp for breath and you will see a remarkable difference in the quality of your sleep over a relatively short period of time. Now mouth taping sounds scary.

[47:01] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah it is a bit weird at first.

SPEAKER_03: It’s a bit weird at first and it’ll create a few giggles with with your partner but but um you know um I uh I I put a cross actually on on my mouth because I’ve got a bit of a beard quite thin quite yeah relatively thin so just use a micropore tape and and just put a cross. You can still talk you can still talk you can still breathe through your mouth if you need to um but it it’s it the idea is that it keeps your mouth closed tongue where it where it should be and you nasal breathe. All the time you nasal breathe at night you’re breathing much slower much deeper and much lighter and all those are you know the right way to for for for you to be breathing.

[47:49] Sammie Ellard-King:

I love that yeah yeah I’ve tried it and now I’m just I don’t I can’t sleep without it um because I just notice the difference and I also don’t get the like 3am elbow like shut up you’re starting again you’re get off your back like uh literally is a nightly occurrence if I don’t have it. I didn’t take it on holiday recently and um two nights in I was like what is going on my I had that sort of like fog back and it was it’s very interesting when you look at it like that. But yeah I think it’s beneficial for you but also your partner if you are a snorer um but the quality of sleep is really interesting because I I I wear a whoop and the you can track the the quality of your sleep on it and my REM so your dream state sleep is 25% up on the month where I wasn’t um and that’s a remarkable difference in the amount of deep sleep that I get in terms of performance for me in terms of training work everything it’s it’s remarkable.

[48:58] Dan Hughes:

Yeah I mean we live such uh hectic connected lives that our brains need proper time to to rest and restore and cleanse and process and you know again if you are in that heightened state for the majority of the day and then you go to bed and you’re not sleeping well your brain is still in that heightened state and it can’t cleanse it can’t repair it can’t process all the all the data um so sleep is a you know is a key part of of what we you know what we coach from a um from a health and wellbeing point of view if you are breathing well during rest then your body has got half a chance to be to breathe well when the metabolic demand on your body is much higher.

[49:43] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah yeah absolutely last part of it this really is the getting in some cold yes and that I think that alone is number one is the hardest part because it is you have to every day I do it I’m like don’t don’t do it I mean don’t do it don’t don’t do it what are you doing but then after you do it for a few times the way it makes you feel is like it’s like you’re in the middle of having like the best night out ever and you’re like you’re in that moment where you’re like you turn to your mate and you’re like yeah like love you man and that’s how you feel but you feel like that for like five six hours which it is absolutely insane that it’s not easy.

[50:29] Dan Hughes:

I love that analogy of you know in the middle of the best night out ever I think that’s really cool. But there there are again scientific reasons why that feels the way it does. So when you get into the cold um dopamine is is massively increased oxytocin is massively increased serotonin and a whole load of endorphins as well the f all the feel good ones um so so you get a huge whack of all that good stuff flowing flowing through your body it goes back to that you know that that positive stress you know good stress for your body getting into the cold on a regular basis and you don’t need a fancy ice bath to do it you can do it cold showers are just as just as effective yeah um but I think what you’re referring to is the is the is the mindset you need to build in order to get regularly into the cold and that is the thing that makes you feel all powerful to get into as a warm blooded mammal getting into the cold is one of the most difficult things we can do because all the alarm bells are saying do not do it. This is you know we’re we need to stay warm to function you know don’t get into the cold and if you can if you can overcome that that fear and if you can um if you can create that strong and positive mindset that says I don’t care what you’re telling me not to do I’m gonna do it it makes you all powerful and and you know I’ve found since I’ve been practicing cold exposure that you know there have been some quite difficult decisions to to make they’ve been much much easier to make because you know I can get in the I can get in the ice bar.

[52:06] Sammie Ellard-King:

You’re totally right is it is true like with the breath work and then combining that with the cold exposure has been like nuts because it’s just like I’m like I’ve done the hardest thing today. My body’s done the hardest thing today and I’m like everything after that is just like oh whatever you know okay fine cool we’ve got to go and do that and also like for mood as well like regulating mood because I’m quite up and down naturally as a person and I find that I’m way more sustained and a lot happier um and that’s been a massive transformation since I’ve started doing it. You know I did buy a fancy ice bath it was only 100 odd quid it wasn’t expensive and it was a blew the thing up put a bit of cold water in it chuck a bit of ice in each time and just you know get in for a couple of minutes two three minutes uh but you can just turn the cold on the thing on the shower.

[53:00] Dan Hughes:

On the shower yeah it’s so easy yeah absolutely and again for those that want to give this a go the the the key the key with getting in and out of the cold is is your breath once again so if you’re really concerned about you know oh my god you know a cold shower is going to make me scream just focus on your breath and make your exhale once again as long and as gentle as you possibly can. So as you turn that dial down just focus on your breath nothing else matters the water’s cold doesn’t matter just focusing on my breath just keep that exhale going next breath in through the nose focus on your exhale and before you know it you’ll be up to 30 45 you know seconds very very quickly and if you do that if you do that regularly you know three four five times a week you’ll you’ll get all the benefits of of this cold exposure. It’s not just about making you feel good it’s not just about giving you a strong mindset. Yes there are some really really powerful health benefits to to getting cold. Yes you know reducing inflammation encouraging better circulation balancing hormones um you know balancing those those those mood swing hormones um so it you know there’s a whole whole sequence of stuff that’s really good for you as well yeah yeah and um one of the big things I listened to the Andrew Huberman Cold Exposure podcast was uh the uh it kickstart your immune system at like I think it’s something ridiculous like 200-300% increase in your body’s ability to fight off disease and any sort of cold flu anything like that as well yeah absolutely that that that immune build um resilience is is is uh enhanced by cold exposure but also by breath work as well by the way now my immune system is compromised as I said earlier um there have been loads of bugs flowing through our household over the course of the winter uh and and you know and last winter as well and I have been 100% okay you’ve not been having anything I’ve not had anything and I was the one that we used to catch you know catch it at the first the first hurdle so you know there is there is science sat behind this that demonstrates that immunity is is improved and energy is improved and sleep is improved and all that sort of thing um but you know I’m living proof in the background that that this stuff really works you know I’m I have not been ill I don’t get headaches anymore you know I’m I’m sleeping as I should do I’m sharp I’m focused you know concentrated uh and yeah just I just feel I feel amazing as a result of it all and and and it’s accessible to everybody. Yeah yeah absolutely I think to sort of land the plane on this is there anything I think it’s important just to make sure because you know is there anyone that shouldn’t be doing this you mentioned the the high blood pressure pregnancy is there any more yeah so epilepsy anybody who suffers from epilepsy is is you know should not be practicing this stuff without any uh you know any confirmation from their their GP uh anybody who’s pregnant or breastfeeding uh anybody with a heart condition or blood pressure or anybody really that has got a serious health condition you know I I would just double check with your GP that that you’re okay to go. I think you know there are there are breath exercises that help reduce stress and anxiety that are safe for everybody. So that one we’ve just done with the finger under our nose that’s perfectly safe for for everybody. You’re not gonna you know you’re not gonna cause yourself any any damage there. And you know that there’s another exercise that I would encourage everybody to have in their toolkit which is the cupped hands exercise which is uh you know placing your your hands over your your mouth and nose and breathing in and out through through your mouth and nose that is safe for everybody. And it’s very so again what we’re doing is we are uh we’re dialing down anxiety and stress.

[57:06] Sammie Ellard-King:

Okay.

SPEAKER_03: So if you’re if you’ve just come out of a really bad meeting for example and you’re really concerned about it go and sit yourself at your desk with your elbows on your on your on your desk, your fingers under your chin, cup your hands around your mouth and your nose and just breathe in and out through your nose to the counter four. So into the counter four and out to the counterfour and really feel the areas around your lower ribs under your armpits really focus your attention on drawing that air in down nice and low down there. Just breathe in and out to the counter four just intercupped hands just again for 90 seconds or so and you will find you feel different afterwards. Everything will be much much calmer your heart rate drops down you know your your respiratory rate drops right down everything is you know it is is much much calmer.

[58:06] Sammie Ellard-King:

Dan I think you’re gonna change some lives today. I really do know because I think I think it’s just it’s so easy to do this and just the benefits are just nuts. Like and I feel like it’s something that everyone can do and everyone knows that they need to breathe properly and everybody knows that you know every we’ve gone in a cold shower or jumped in a cold lake you feel pretty good after everyone knows that but they’re just it’s that fear of like just doing the thing and they’re also like you know I’m a busy person. I don’t have five ten minutes so you know you’re sitting on a train. Exactly you’re sitting in you know in a car you can you can do these things uh you know obviously if you’re driving but perhaps a little bit different but you know you’ve got five minutes after a meeting and that’s the benefits it sets you right up for the rest of the day.

[58:58] Dan Hughes:

Even if you don’t get the chance during the day just try to breathe properly at night. Okay. Just mouth tape at night get the breath forced in in and out through your nose uh and that you know you will be you will be way ahead of of everybody else and if you’ve got kids at home try to get them to mouth tape at night as well they will they will remember stuff much better they will perform much better at school they’ll be much more relaxed they’ll be much more focused their faces will develop better as well believe it or not there’s a study done in Brazil that shows the difference in children’s facial features between mouth breathers and nose breathers.

SPEAKER_02: Yeah that’s why they say I got ugly uh when I hit when I hit when I hit teens I was a very cute kid not so much now it’s mouth breathing guys uh but it’s true that that there’s a I read that same um study I think there’s been a follow up a couple of follow-ups from that as well like you get uglier.

[59:59] Dan Hughes:

You get uglier your dental structure is affected uh your mouth it your breath smells awful so yeah there’s there there are a whole host of you know whole host of reasons why you shouldn’t be breathing through your mouth but but like I say if you don’t if you don’t remember to to breathe well during the day just make sure you breathe well at night because that gives you six or seven or eight hours of really good quality breathing as you should do giving your brain the opportunity to cleanse and repair as it should do and we’ll set you up for the for the day going forward.

SPEAKER_02: And someone wants to do this like really quickly in the morning how can they do that?

SPEAKER_03: Is it YouTube or yeah loads of stuff on YouTube. For those um of your subscribers who want to learn a little bit more about this um I will send them a free PDF with some of these exercises listed out on so if they you know if they have a stressful moment at work they can just refer to that particular exercise or they’re struggling to get to sleep at night they can refer to uh you know another exercise so um so somehow we’ll figure out how we’ll leave it in the show notes for everybody how we get that circulated to everybody. But yeah they’re just just you know it I I guess my top tip really is just to focus on breathing in and out through your nose focus on breathing in and out through your nose nice and light nice and slow and nice and deep so not big breaths because a big breath takes you straight to your chest a deep breath takes you down nice and low. That’s where the breath needs to go.

[61:34] Sammie Ellard-King:

Dan I’ve absolutely love this it’s been really fun um where can people come find you? I know you do some amazing work some corporate days some sessions as well people can attend.

SPEAKER_03: Yeah so we do uh workshops courses and classes um down in our base uh in West Sussex although we do travel around the country um we do uh lots of corporate um sessions as well so um helping you know corporate uh groups of you know groups of of managers or or staff understand the power that is is held in their breath um so any of those kind of inquiries through our website um vitaevi.co.uk um uh we’ll I guess we’ll put those in the show notes as well. But yeah just just reach out. And if you’ve got any other you know breath questions you know uh I’d be really happy to answer them because for me doing what I do now you know isn’t all about the money. I would have stayed in my very well paid corporate job if that was the case. I’m I my mission you know is to help other people now. And if I’ve got um you know if I’ve got the opportunity to answer a concern or a question from anybody then I’d be really happy to do so.

[62:51] Sammie Ellard-King:

Yeah love that mate honestly and I just lastly thank you so much as well for everything. It’s been yeah absolutely eye opening for me this year and uh and for Charlotte my partner as well she’s uh she’s absolutely loved it so uh yeah cheers for coming on mate my pleasure thank you