Ibrahim Braimah: How to Grow Wealth With Airbnb

This transcript is auto-generated and lightly edited for readability, it may contain errors.

[0:00] Sammie Ellard-King: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Money Gains podcast. I’ve just wrapped with Ibrahim Braimah, who is the Airbnb coach on Instagram. Man, what an episode. Absolutely blew my mind. In an area that I don’t really know uh that much about at all. So it was really good for me to learn as well. A different way of thinking when it comes to investing your money and what the property gurus and the courses will tell you. He has flipped that model completely on his head and is making some serious cash in the Airbnb space, but not how you might think it. So listen up. If you’re listening on YouTube, whack that subscribe button. And if you’re listening on Spotify or Apple Podcasts, give us a follow and share this episode with a friend. It really does help the show. But for now, let’s get started on the Money Gains Podcast. Ibrahim, welcome to the Money Gains Podcast, man.

[1:07] Ibrahim Braimah: How are you doing? I’m good, bro. I’m good, man. Thank you very much for having me. I’m I’m super excited about this conversation we’re about to have. So I’m looking forward to it, bro. Looking forward to it, man. Yeah, man. I’ve been following you for ages. And like as a budding investor, you kind of look at the property game and then you’re like in awe of the guys that are absolutely killing it. Um and you know, your name keeps cropping up on I listened to you actually on Peter’s podcast recently, The Conversation of Money. It was such a good interview, man. Thank you, bro. Thank you, man. Um, yeah, I really enjoyed that one. We spoke really with it frankly, spoke about some topics I’m passionate about. I everything I talk about, I you know, I speak quite passionately generally anyway. But um, I really enjoy that podcast, and thank you as well for you know for saying the kind words. It’s it’s crazy because it wasn’t that long ago that you know I was kind of looking at this space and going, oh my god, like there’s you know so many people doing some incredible things, and I and I want to be a part of that. So um, you know, it’s nice to hear. Thank you.

[2:03] Sammie Ellard-King: Like I suppose first question, uh, obviously, like it’d be good to introduce yourself a little bit, but uh why the Airbnb game? Because you you you look at like there’s so many. I mean, when we’re in this space, you follow, I’m sure you follow a million of them yourself. Like there’s hundreds of guys like banging the drum. What made you kind of go, yeah, now that’s for me? Weird. Um, I I I came into the Airbnb space, probably very, very different mindset from everyone else who came into the space because you know, I I used to consult for a one of these, you know, education companies, probably the second largest in the UK. So I was consulting for them. And so that meant I was doing webinars, I was speaking on stages, and just obviously attracting people to come into this industry and and build wealth through property. But one thing that I noticed pretty quickly was not as quickly as I would have liked it, to be fair, because it takes some time before you start making judgments, right? But you know, I was there for the best part of two years. But after a while, I started thinking, hang on, a lot of these people are coming in, they’re not making the money, but yeah, they’re investing thousands and tens of thousands of pounds into just the mentorship side of things. So like there’s this there’s just this connection that’s not happening. And for me, I’ll be I’ll speak really frankly, you know, 85% of the people who came into those rooms look like me. They’re black, right? So there’s just this extra, like, oh, I don’t, I don’t feel good about this. Because people come up to me and say, hey, you know what, when I saw you, I said I must do this. But I’m thinking, hang on, now I’ve got the data and I know your likelihood of success is very, very minimal. And so I actually came into property from you know um traditional background, so an estate agency, and then I worked for a property investment firm in the city. So for me, I came from a different angle, and that’s probably what I would have focused on. But when I saw these markets, I started thinking, well, why are people not getting results? And I started to analyze a little bit deeper and understood that the way people were being taught to do Airbnb, it’s actually not the friendliest way, the easiest way to do it, or to scale. Um, and that’s when I thought, okay, you know what, I want to help all these people, I want to show them an easier way to do it. I believe there’s got to be an easier way. At this point, I wasn’t exactly sure what that way was, but I thought there’s got to be an easier way. Let me just think about my experience. Let me think about the investors that I work with, what would appeal to them. Um, and then if I can find something that works, then I’m gonna show people how to do it. Once I realised, you know, what works, well, instead of just teaching people how to do it, why don’t I go and build a business doing it first? Because you might understand something um theoretically, but when you’re doing it practically, there’s gonna be so many nuances in between, you know, that if you’re not doing it, you won’t be able to. How can you teach someone who’s doing something you’re not, and they’re asking you a specific question, and you can’t really answer it because you understand, you know, the theory of it, but you don’t understand it practically. So that’s how I came into this, into this Airbnb space. So yeah, a little bit unorthodox, but nonetheless, we find ourselves here.

[5:02] Sammie Ellard-King: You got a wall of walk, haven’t you? 100%, 100%. There’s there’s just no other way. There’s just no other way to do it. If you’re not doing it, you know, it doesn’t matter how much experience you have in the field because property, there’s so many different strategies. You know, I understand property. If I was to go and start teaching someone how to do commercial conversions now, like I could explain to you the benefits of it. I could explain, I understand how it works and how you can make money doing it, but me trying to teach someone, you know, it would just be crazy because I haven’t done it myself, right? It doesn’t really make sense. But listen, other people choose to do that, that’s their path. Um, I’m not I’m not sort of head to, you know, to to say what’s right or wrong. But for me, I just don’t feel that that’s something that you should be able to do if you haven’t done it yourself. I completely agree with you, man. So let’s let’s let’s backtrack a little bit because your journey is amazing. Um, you know, you’ve come from completely like homelessness in a way. Well, it you it’s on your pro it’s on your profile as one of your as one of your things to where you are today, which is you know admirable. So talk us through that and and and how that sort of uh shaped you.

[6:09] Ibrahim Braimah: Um yeah, I mean it’s difficult. I’ve spoken about this quite a bit. I’m just trying to think of where to start, right? Because well, if you if you if you want us to start there, I’ll I’ll start from that point because I guess for me, the the the way that came about was you know, me, you know, coming from from Nigeria, being in this country, it’s a different environment, all of this type of things. I’ve been in for a few years, and my mom started to have this panic of, you know, where she thought maybe things are going there in a direction that she wouldn’t like them to go. So, you know, her answer to that, and it’s this is the answer for a lot of um African immigrants that understand this is we’re sending you back home, right? You’re going back home. That’s it, this is not happening. So that was my mom’s solution to send me back to Nigeria. And um I wasn’t gonna go. I wasn’t gonna go. I was I was old enough at this point, I was 16 at this point, I said, I’m not going back. And you know, ultimately it came to a point where, you know, the the night before actually, I was meant to go back. I had sat down with them to just say, hey, look, like I understand this is what how you guys feel. Because I didn’t actually feel like I was a bad child. I wasn’t a bad child, you know, I was around bad people and I knew what bad was, right? So I was like, but I understand you guys feel this way, but please let’s work something out, all of this. And you know, there wasn’t a resolution to it. But I already had a plan, I already had my escape plan already, already sold it. So I didn’t knew, I wasn’t going to that airport. They didn’t know this, but I knew this, right? I was just trying to, you know, to um come to an agreement with them. So the next day, time to go. I said, Look, cool, my friend, hey, come pick me up already, the plans already set. Uh, and then that’s that. But obviously, you don’t really kind of think past that. I uh well, as a young man, I didn’t think past that, okay. Your friend comes and gets you, you sleep on the sofa for one or two nights, like, what’s the next plan? Right? And that’s something I didn’t really think about. And you know, that’s ultimately how I found myself homeless, right? That situation went on for, you know, for for a couple years, a few years. Um so yeah, that’s that’s that’s how I came to find myself in that in that in that situation, yeah.

[8:09] Sammie Ellard-King: And is that like, was there a support system to help you get back on your feet there, or was it really quite difficult? Yeah, you know, in all honesty, there I guess you could say there wasn’t, there wasn’t. I I I would like to say there wasn’t completely, but the truth is, uh, I was young. I was young, and at this point now I’m young, and I found myself, I guess you could call it freedom in a way, autonomy. Um, but uh you could call it that. So that meant I could actually do what I wanted, right? I had that freedom. So, you know, when I first when that situation first happened, you get in contact with the council. Um, can they help you sort something out? I ended up finding myself in the YMCA, which you know wasn’t the most conducive of environments, and then very quickly, you know, found myself being kicked out. Imagine being kicked out of the YMCA, like, shit, man, your stuff wasn’t really bad. Um, but that’s what happened, and that was obviously when the support system got cut off. And I’m talking this is six months after, you know, um I got kicked out of home. So, you know, for the remaining two years, two and a half plus years, that was just me just trying to you know figure my own way.

[9:55] Sammie Ellard-King: And then you ended up at uni, so how how did that happen? Because that’s uh at some point, at some point, you’ve got to I and I’m a massive, massive believer in this. And again, this is why I you know chose down that Airbnb rule, because I understood that, well, actually, if you’ve got no excuse and you’ve got no reasons, and you know, there’s a strategy that once you learn it, all you’ve got to do is put effort in. It doesn’t matter about your credit, your money, all of these type of things, you can actually do it. Um, that’s one of the reasons why I chose that strategy. But for me, at some point you have to take accountability. And I always talk about this. I remember, you know, the way people used to look at me, you know, when I was homeless, right? Like to this day, whenever I speak about it, I get a little feeling. Um so I remember the way people used to look at me. But I never looked at myself in that way. I never saw myself in that way. The way that I saw myself was I can still achieve anything that I wanted to achieve. Um, but there was this sort of look of, you know, kind of homeless, you’re done, like you’re not really gonna achieve anything, type of thing. But I never internalized that. I never internalized that. But it was just this, this, this particular night that I’ll never forget because it was the night that I made the decision to change my life. And I’m I’m sleeping in a garage. I’m in this garage and it’s you know, it’s bags, boxes, normal rubbish, you know, and we’re just in the corner there, you got cardboard box on the floor, and and this is my home, right? And I remember on this particular night, October. So we’re probably talking, was it 2006 and I’m trying to think of the years, but it was October, we’re in October now. And you know, it’s raining, it’s cold, it’s freezing, and there’s just a little gap in between the bottom of the door and the and the floor of the garage, and the wind is blowing the rain in, my duva is getting wet. I’m sitting there just embarrassed. Sometimes you just it’s almost like having an out-of-body experience, and I’m looking at myself and I’m just thinking to myself, everything that I had done in my life had gotten me to where I am right now. I’m homeless and I felt ashamed of myself. And that’s when I said, like, this is this is not going to be my life. Like, this ain’t it. This is this has got to change. And that was really the first time that I decided to, you know, to ask for help. Um, and that was to, you know, my teacher, Mr. Adams, who he’d always been that one, even when I was at school acting of it was my history teacher. So history and English are two of my favourite subjects. Um, and he just always saw the the ability, right? Not before I saw it, I’ve always had this thing in me, in all honesty, but no one else saw it. Right? He saw it. So I I hoped he would help. Um, and he did. Right. And just under two years from that point is obviously when I made it to Union, then then the rest is is history.

[12:48] Sammie Ellard-King: Mate, amazing. And then what did you you went and studied at uni? What did you study? Business. Yeah, nice. And we were both at Southampton as well. What a city, eh? It was good. It was good. I under I enjoyed something I was there for the best part of eight years. So you’re not good times. Yeah, good times for sure. And I heard I you know, I won’t won’t make you relive the same story and talking about the same thing on every podcast, but that story about you going into the estate agents was wicked. I love that, man. Like just getting yourself into it, and then it’s one of those like never give up stories. And like I suppose that’s kind of shaped you really into where where you got to today. So you what from what I took from that, you moved back to London. And do you feel like because I did this, and I wanted to ask you about this because I I worked in Southampton for a couple of years after uni, I um helped run junk nightclub, which was uh junk or dunk, yeah, junk, come on, London Road.

[13:53] Ibrahim Braimah: You you know the estate as I’m talking about then actually, you’re not opposite junk, you know you got that strip. I had that vision in my head when you were talking about so you were literally walking with me, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, oh, I was seeing it. You were like, you said thing about the little gaps in between when you get your get your shit together before you move into the next one. Yeah, yeah. I was like, I know exactly what he’s talking about. That was so funny, man. So I was I was living that as you were telling it, I was like, oh man, like I would pop out for a cigarette and just stand and stare at all of the all of the um estate agents on that row, you know. It’s just it’s just it’s a long street. But um yeah, you moved back to London. I I found it um really difficult at first. Like I had to go and do uh some roles that I probably would never have done, you know, but I actually ended up doing this sales job, which uh I did for like six months, and that like completely changed everything for me. Um gave me the confidence of who I am. How how did you find that kind of like leaving uni moment? Because a lot of uh people go through this, like they they they’re like finish uni, they might be in like a Manchester or Leeds and they’re from the south or vice versa. Like, and they’re like, where do I go? What do I do? Like, you know, how did you find that?

[15:09] Ibrahim Braimah: You’ve got to understand, and and I think this is probably one of my you know, something that I need to work on personally, um, attachment. I I don’t really have any attachments to anything. Um, I don’t know if it’s a good thing um from an emotional standpoint, but I’ve always moved around. You know, even when I was in Nigeria, I was born in a village, you know, from the village I moved to Lagos, which is the city. You know, from Lagos I moved to London, and then from London, we moved to Cambridge. From Cambridge, I actually spent some time in Nottingham, and then from Nottingham, you know, we Cambridge, and then back to, and then obviously went to Union, Southampton. Um, so there’s there’s I’ve always moved around. So for me, it didn’t really feel it didn’t really feel weird. I don’t I don’t have any attachment to anywhere. It’s not really something that bothers me. You know, even as we speak in here right now, I can pack up and move somewhere else. And yeah, it wouldn’t really affect me in a way, you know. I’ve got a core group of friends, and you know, that’s always gonna remain the same. So that doesn’t really matter. That that’s not gonna change. Um and and as long as that’s the case, I genuinely um it’s not something that that affects me, um, in all honesty.

[16:21] Sammie Ellard-King: So what about the like moving from a job into the London where it’s like it’s levels up time now? Like, yeah, yeah. Again, if you if you kind of go back to to what I was saying, is even when I was homeless, bro, like even at those points when people would look at me and project, you know, upon me the way that they felt about me, even then I still had the confidence within myself. Even though I was in a state where you’re like, where’s that confidence even coming from? Even then I had the confidence, right? So for me, that’s not really been something that I’ve ever really kind of struggled with. Um so yes, I wanted to come into the London, play with the big boys, and let’s see what this is all about, but it wasn’t a case of I didn’t think I could do it. I wanted to come and do it, if that makes sense. Um, so you know, like most people, when you come to London, you have to pretty much start at the bottom, you know. So when I came into London, I think I mentioned in the previous podcast I was working, you know, for one of my friends who had a security company, right? So I was actually on doors doing the security job. So this is just this is the route of passage where you come from to London, right?

[17:26] Sammie Ellard-King: That’s what I mean. Like I was doing, you know, bar jobs, I’d probably stay there two, three weeks and just be like, nah, this ain’t for me. You’re just chopping around trying to find things. But actually, all of those combinations of things now have like made me into who I am today. Like, if I haven’t got and struggled, because I was I was like, I’m not moving home. I’m not, I’m not, I’m not doing that. Like, I don’t want to go back there. I, you know, not nothing to do with my parents, it was just more like my own independence. I was like, nah, I’m gonna do this for myself no matter what, if and if I struggle. Um, but you know, you end up doing a load of rubbish that you don’t want to do, and then I fell into like realise when what I actually wanted to do. It’s like yeah, what was that? It has to happen. So I started out in marketing, so I did um marketing for hospitality businesses, and then um I grew up into director level and then opened my own businesses and sites from there, man, and it’s just kind of gone and grown. But you know, I I built up about 24 grand’s worth of debt when I came out of Southampton. Yeah, so um I’d like Southampton as my fond memories, and then like also is where I built up all my debt. So I moved back to London to kind of like fresh start and new like blinkers on, and you know, thankfully it paid off. And and that’s why I’m sort of starting the business today because so many people have you know had these this happen to them or don’t know the value of a pound and don’t know how to bring themselves forward, invest in the stock market property, which I’m sure we’ll get into now. Um so you know, it’s about giving people a platform to learn about that for stuff for sure.

[19:03] Ibrahim Braimah: Absolutely. I love that one. I love that. And just imagine, and this is why you know I talk about risk or the way that people perceive risk when it comes to entrepreneurship, and you think if if people could only just bring the future to today, I think they would look at entrepreneurship very, very differently. Right? Um, if you could see what this trajectory of where you’re leading to, because I’ve I’ve spoken to people now, you know, in when you’re working in an organization where it’s coaching based, you know, you’re speaking to people who are really scared of the futures or people who have now kind of realised, you know, this this this um this pattern, you know, that I’ve been taught actually is a lie, or actually it’s not going to serve me because now they’re close to retirement and they’re looking at a £200 a week retirement package, thinking, I’m gonna I’ve given you my best years, four years down the line. So if people could see that, would they really perceive right now while you’ve got the energy, you know, while you’ve got the strength to just try to do something for yourself that’s gonna mean you get to write your own checks, you know, at a later stage, would they really perceive that as risk? I think just going through the normal, mundane, nan to file, I think that’s the real risk, but it’s it’s difficult because the the narrative around it is that entrepreneurship is risky. And of course we know there’s you know there’s risks that you take, but it’s all about how you perceive risk.

[20:20] Sammie Ellard-King: Absolutely. I couldn’t agree more with you. You know, I did a video on this literally last week. It’s like, you know, the average pension pot 37 grand uh plus a state pension leaves you with 12 grand a year. Like that’s not enough. I don’t care who you are, like where you are, that’s not enough in most cases. And you know, that’s below the poverty line in the UK for most people, and you’ve struggled your whole life to get to that point. And now you need the most support. It’s not as if, okay, cool, it’s 12 grand, I’m I’m 16 years old, I haven’t got rent to pay. Like, no, you’ve accumulated all these things in your life. Hopefully, you’ve paid off your mortgage, but if you haven’t, you’ve got mortgage to pay, you need more care and support, maybe you need some medication. And now you’re earning the least you’ve ever earned in life. It’s like this is the most vulnerable period in your life, and you’re earning the least you’ve ever earned. Those two things don’t marry up. And it’s not like you’ve been bumming around your whole life, you’ve been working hard your whole life, giving your blood so intense. So yeah, it just doesn’t add up.

[21:17] Sammie Ellard-King: No, I completely agree. And there’s so many ways for people to change that. Even if they’re in a nine to five, they can still get themselves in a position if they started today, you know, 15, 20 years down the line, that situation will look completely different for them. You know, there’s obviously multiple avenues of investment. Um so I’d love to unpack this a little bit. So property investing, man. Hit us with the ones and twos. Like, what what what is it from your perspective? Because as you said earlier, so many different avenues you can go down. Yeah, I mean, that’s I’ll be honest, that’s a very broad question. And I understand if you’re looking from the outside, yeah, you’re like, listen, you’re like property investing, let’s talk about it. All right, from the outside, I get it because it’s just property is breaks and water. But how long you got? Yeah, yeah. But but the one thing I’ll I’ll try to I’ll try to break it down so hopefully, um, hopefully the audience understands you know my my point of view on this. What I always say to people who come to me, so you know, my students come to me because they want to do Airbnb, that’s fine. Other people come to me because they just don’t understand what they want to do in property. And the first thing I always say to them is, what do you want to achieve? What’s the goal? What’s the ultimate outcome of what you want to achieve through property? Because the beauty about property is it doesn’t matter what you want to achieve, you can achieve all of it through property with a different strategy. You know, so if, for example, you’re saying, I just want, I need more money, I want to replace my income, which is where a lot of people want to do when they want to come into property, then that means. Looking for a cash flow and strategy. You’re not looking for to do a deal today, and then you don’t know if the next deal is going to come in three months, six months, twelve months. You want money coming in every single month. Okay, well, there’s some strategies that can help you with that. Airbnb is one of those. Deal packaging is another one of those. Okay, cool. Well, we’ll look at those two strategies and then we’ll talk about the pros and cons. You decide which one’s gonna suit you best. If you’re saying, well, I just want to build a portfolio, you know, for you know, for my kids, my future, I want to build a portfolio so by the time I get to retirement, I’ve got a cash flow of X. Brilliant. You know, we’re gonna start looking at things like buy to let’s maybe you’re gonna flip some of those as well, you know, get bigger lump sums of cash in and then use them to buy more and more properties. You can have a combination of you know flipping properties as well as just the vanilla buy to let’s or maybe we could look at buy-to-lets with Airbnb. All right, so you can increase your cash flow, increase your ROI, your yields. Okay, if you’re someone who just wants big lump sums of cash, then okay, maybe we could look at something like commercial conversion, or we can look at land development. What do you want? All right, what do you want? What does that future look like for you? What is your goal from this? And then we can determine which strategy to go for. But there’s a strategy for all of them. So in terms of property investing, it’s diverse in what it can give you. But where people tend to go wrong is they want to do all of those things, yeah, you know, but you know, if you if you focus, it always said, you know, Jack of Ultra is master of none. If you try to focus on all those things, ultimately you get to the end of the year, zero results, and you’re frustrated. 100%.

[24:14] Sammie Ellard-King: Like, you know, it’s it goes to any point of life, jack of all trades, man. You can’t do it all like zero down, sub-niche, hit it hard. And and that’s where they’re in the you know, they say the niches are in uh riches are in the niches. Riches in the niches. I was listening to Alex Hormozi the other day. Um, I mean, he’s someone, if anyone’s thinking about being an entrepreneur, by the way, you know, go and listen to Alex Hormozi, the guy that guy knows exactly what he’s talking about, you know. But he said it’s when you realise, and I’m not trying to put anyone off here, trust me, entrepreneurship has incredible merits. I recommend it to everybody, right? Like you said, even if you want to start a side hustle, trust me, do it. But when people realise just how difficult it is to master something, that’s when they realise they just have to focus on one thing and just do that. Right? Because if you truly want to be great at this thing, if you truly want to be really good at this, then you’re going to understand, you know, once you start going down that rabbit hole, you realise like, whoa, there’s so much for me to learn to become great at this. So it’s like, well, I can’t do this and do this as well, it’s just not gonna work, right? So um, yeah, that’s it.

[25:28] Sammie Ellard-King: 100%. Like, even building this business today where I’ve got to now, you know, like it’s a culmination of probably 15 years worth of marketing experience for me to be able to go out and build this brand. But if I’m looking at this from somebody today thinking, you know, I want to build what he’s got, like that’s not gonna happen, mate. Like, because you don’t know how to do socials, email marketing, website building, SEO. Like, it’s just taking me 15 years to build up. But what you can do is go and like start with social media and nail that and then take on another thing. And once you’ve got systems in place for that, you move on to the next one. And or you stay in those lanes and you just win. And that th that like that’s really what I’m trying to explain to people when it comes to investing as well. You know, like you have to pick uh a strategy and then you have to run with that strategy and go for it. And then that might vary based on who you are as a person, where you are tolerance to risk. You know, they’re all going to be very overall being factors are based on what you can actually do with your money. Um let’s say for example, like because a lot of a lot of people at the m right now are just thinking, you know, I want to be I want to get on a property ladder, I’m not I’m a first home, but I want to be a I want to ha own my first home, you know, and that’s becoming harder and harder for people. But then they look at this Airbnb option and and the and the kind of taking on serviced accommodation properties and they think, well, how the hell am I gonna do that if I’ve got to save that 50 grand for my first place and then 50 grand for the next one? Like that’s a way that a lot of people think. But uh as we both know, that’s you know myths in a lot of ways, and there are ways around it. So what are some of the ways that people sort of can get into it like that?

[27:11] Ibrahim Braimah: Yeah, so I mean, f first of all, if if someone is thinking from uh from an entrepreneurial mindset, if someone just wants to buy their own home and they’re just like because it’s this British thing of owning your own home, if that’s where they’re coming from, then cool. You know, I can’t really convince you otherwise because you know that’s that’s ingrained in you. But if you’re thinking about from an entrepreneurial standpoint, because people do, but yet they buy their home to live in. You know, I always say, you know, your first home, your first purchase should not be one that you’re buying to live in, because that’s a liability. Ultimately, it’s a liability. You’ve pumped all this money in and you’ve still got to be pumping money every single month into it. You know, it’s only an investment if you’ve you know you’ve saved up all that money, you’ve put that in, and there’s going to be a return and ROI on that. Now you can argue obviously the property is going to appreciate, you’re gonna get ROI at some point, yes, of course. But what you could have done is actually just doubled up in that time. All right. So um, so that would be the first, the first thing I would say. If you’re if you’re thinking about it from that perspective, then the first purchase should actually be an investment property. So buy the property, let someone else rent the property, and let someone else pay your mortgage, etc. But if you’ve got no money and you want to get started, or you haven’t got you know 50, 60 grand, you know, to buy your first property, then you know, again, Airbnb is one route. Again, that’s the reason why I chose this route. Because, you know, coming from you know where I was, you know, no money, no credit, no one believes in me enough to be a guarantor, you know, how do you still make money through property? And I had to really go back and look at where I started as an estate agent and said, okay, cool. Well, as estate agents, you know, we were not renting properties from landlords. Because that’s what puts people off. Well, I’ve got to pay rent, I’ve got a pay deposit, then I’ve got to, you know, furniture property, all of these type of things. But if you flip it, and this is what I did, and this is what the industry teaches, it is this rent-to-rent model, you know, where you have to go and rent the property, first month rent, you go put deposit down, then you go furnish the property. That’s six, seven, eight thousand pounds. Like, hang on. You’re trying to, you’re trying to help this person make money and change their financial situation. And you’re telling them they’ll go and dump six grand into every deal they do. You know, I’ve never seen it. Just imagine a business that the cost of acquisition for each individual product is six thousand pounds. How quickly can you scale that business without literally raising millions? It’s insane. Um, so I mean, look, obviously, people may, they might not want to make millions, they might just want to make a few thousand pounds a month. But then what that means is you’re just you’re you’re making the time to profitability longer. Because even if you put all this money in, then you go away eight to twelve months before you start actually becoming profitable in that market space. And that’s if you’ve done everything perfectly. You know, first year of business, is it really going to be perfect? This is it, right? So people don’t factor all these things in. So I said, well, how can we do this without this cost of acquisition? So again, I went back to my background, estate agency, and said, Well, we didn’t rent properties from landlords, we just managed the properties for landlords. Why can’t we do the same here? So I did some research, looked at the market space, and said, Well, hang on, the biggest players in the market space are doing exactly that. They’re not renting each property because again, that’s going to cost them loads of money. You know, there’s people that’ve got 500 units, a thousand units. That cost them millions. So they’re not renting. So why isn’t everyone else doing this? But then what I looked, what I understood is these are two different business models. Someone who’s just trying to build a property business is looking at that property business very differently from someone who’s trying to coach you on how to build a property business. They’re thinking what’s going to sound the sexiest that I can just dangle in front of you and make you give me money. And that’s it. That’s ultimately what it comes down to because they cannot say to you, hey, well, you’re gonna make a thousand pounds plus property. Okay, but if it’s taking you 12 months to find that one deal that you can actually do, and in a year, you’re taking 10 properties that’s giving you five, six hundred pounds profit a month, who’s making more money? Right? And this is the mindset. So people just need to understand that you know you can get started in this business without putting any of your own money down. But what I always say to my students is the amount of money you make is in direct proportion to the amount of value you put out in the market space. So just because, you know, he said, I want to get started, I’m just gonna manage and I’m not gonna, you know, uh it’s not gonna cost me anything. Okay, cool, but what’s in it for the other person? Why would that landlord just want to give you their property to manage? You know, why would they want to flip completely to an Airbnb model when they can just stick to what they’re doing right now? And that’s really where you’ve got to understand the market space and understand, okay, cool, what’s the problem that I’m solving? What’s the problem people have right now, and how does this model, you know, that I’m advising them to take on actually solve that problem? You know, that’s when we start looking at things like, you know, you know, the cost of living crisis, you know, which is making landlords a little bit nervous. Because look, you your tenant could lose their job tomorrow. Then what happens? At the same time, you’ve got mortgages just skyrocketing, which means well, as a landlord, I need to try and make more money somehow. But if I pass all of that increase over to my tenants, I’m putting even more pressure on someone who’s already on pressure, which the likelihood of default then becomes a lot higher. And even if I go down the legal route and say, okay, you know, I’m just gonna evict this person, on average at the moment, it’s taking 12 months when you serve a section 21. So, so, so you and listen, if you serve me a section 21, then what’s the likelihood I’m gonna pay you any money for that 12 months? Ah, well, I’m gonna get kicked out anyway. So I’ll just save my money, right? This is the reality. So this is, you know, exactly that. Once you’re able to articulate, you know, this problem to the landlord, first of all, you’re putting yourself on the pedestal, then know that you understand the problems, you know, so you’re building that credibility and that trust. And then now it’s okay, well, look, there is a solution to it. Here’s how we can help. You know, once you understand those strategies of how you can help, how you can actually implement what you’re proposing to them, and how to articulate the problems that they’ve got, you can make money.

[33:32] Sammie Ellard-King: That’s so interesting. So essentially, you’re taking a landlord’s problem, taking it off the table. But then where’s the benefit for you here? Because, like, let’s say I I kind of understand the Airbnb market a little bit. My um my stepmom has uh annex on the side of her property, she uses it quite heavily. So I’m always telling her to put her prices up, but she’s like, no, stick to stay and she wants to be full as much as possible. But ongoing battle. We won’t get into that bit. Um I’m like, she can make so much money, man. She’s on the like beach in Ramsgate, and like I’m like, oh my god, she’s charging under 100 quid. And I’m like, oh God, put it out, put it out. Um yeah, look, so like I know the type of money that she brings in because she has average occupancy of about 21 days, uh 22 days in the summer that can go higher, and if she gets you know longer lets us it it’s even better for her. Um but then what what where would be the benefit be for that? Because I imagine if she you’re she’s charging a month’s rent, she’d get less money. And is that where the gap is?

[34:32] Ibrahim Braimah: Well, well, this is what I’m saying. So that’s what the industry teaches. They’re saying you just you just give the landlord the rent, and then you you know, you obviously you sign a contract that allows you to sublet the property, you then put the property on the Airbnb and you make all of the uplift, you know, the difference between the rent and what you’re able to generate on the open market, you get to keep us a profit. Goes back to my point. What’s in it for the landlord? Because right now, landlords don’t have a problem of being able to rent out their properties. There’s just a long queue, right? It’s a long queue. Even with the inflation in the market where landlords are having to increase their rent, there’s still a lung queue of people because of the shortage. So that isn’t the landlord’s problem. Their problem is how can I make more money? So what we do is, okay, well, we’re not gonna have to invest any money into this property because it’s your property because we’re managing it for you. We’re not taking it on as our property, which is where we would have to pay rent. We’re not gonna do that. We’re gonna manage it for you, which means every single penny that we generate is actually yours. But obviously, you’ve got to pay us a fee for our service, right? Ah, okay. That’s where the value is for the landlord. And typically, landlords would generate two to three times the revenue from the same property just by flipping the model.

[36:51] Sammie Ellard-King: Mad. And also you then come in with like, we understand the area, we know the pricing points, we know the paying points for the Airbnb buyers in the area. But a lot of landlords are investors, so yes, that’s that’s you know, and you know, why would a landlord use a management company for a tenant? Think about a tenant is there 12 months, you know, it’s not even as active as what Airbnb, because Airbnb you got changeovers all the time. But but landlords still use estate agents and management companies to manage the properties because that’s not, you know, the that’s not what they do. That’s not the business. They’re just investors, they want to stay in ROI. So you have this management company in place to do all of that. So yes, um, we come in with the expertise, and you know, that’s our business, that’s not their business. So your model is okay. So I didn’t get this. So then your model is you keep your money, you pay me to bring you more money.

[37:42] Ibrahim Braimah: Exactly that. Exactly that. It’s not it’s not even they keep the money, we generate them the money. So this is someone who’s you know, I’ll give an example to someone I gave on um conversation on money podcast. So one of my landlords in in um Elephant and Castle, studio flat in Elephant and Castle, rents out for 1,250 pounds. Right? Two months ago, after my fees, I paid him £4,000. Jesus. Exactly that. So we generated them that money, right, because of our skills and our expertise and our understanding of the marketplace. Um so this is this is not even comparable to what he would have been able to get, and that’s £1,250 before any management fees, because you would still have to pay you know a management company an extra 10% or wherever it might be for managing their property. So, you know, the difference is clear in areas that it works. You know, this is not something that works in all areas, and that’s where obviously the education comes in, understanding which areas of the marketplace um you can actually make a profit doing this.

[38:43] Sammie Ellard-King: You took my next question clean out of my house. It was a perfect transition because uh friends of mine have got properties in Lisbon, they’ve got properties in in European countries, and they do exactly this. They they but they they bought and now they Airbnb because they understand the ROI is enormous, um especially for people coming into the city on breaks, etc. They’ve got a problem in these cities, and it’s now said to be coming over to the UK where there’s too much, and there’s actually no locals there anymore, and it’s kind of lost its vibe, and like whole streets can be rentals, and it’s quite crazy. What are you seeing there? And are you kind of fearing any regulation in this area? Not really, because this all has happened. So, first of all, you you know, when when HMO started, you know, when people start realising the value and actually just taking out properties and putting students in there, oh, whole streets have turned to student locations and there’s no more localities and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And that’s cool. That’s just a normal reaction to change, right? Um, but I actually welcome the regulations, you know, because the truth is there are a lot of cowboys in the industry, and until the regulations come, we don’t know which direction to go. We need the regulations to come in. Like that’s what’s going to separate the real professionals who understand what they’re doing and they’re managing their real business to people who just come in and just you know trying, you know, to make money from the industry. But regulation is coming, there’s no taking away from that. But actually, it’s massive credit to the size of the industry who can understand this is a very, very new space. And that’s actually the excitement about the opportunity because it’s a new space. It’s not regulated. Once the regulation comes in, then you know you’re gonna see the difference between the people who are just trying their chances and the people who really understand how to structure a business. But you know, the regulation is not going to, it’s not going to be there to remove the industry because the industry has become too big. We’re making a lot of money in this industry. You know, I’ll give you an example which, you know, in London right now, a lot of people don’t realise this. London is already regulated in the short-term rental space. London has regulations, but it’s probably one of the most profitable cities in the UK. In fact, it is the most profitable city in the UK. So regulations aren’t, they’re not a problem. They’re really not a problem, but they are coming. And I know a lot of people are scared. And look, there are going to be some cities who are going to be like, you can’t do it. Just simple, plain code, you can’t do it here, uh or wherever it might be. But um, most cities will allow it. Most cities will allow it because we’re becoming a very, very strong competitor to hotels. You know, as a product, you know, in my opinion, it’s a much better product than the hotels. You know, there are some kinks, you know, there’s still some little things that we need to iron out, but as a product, it’s a much better product.

[41:28] Sammie Ellard-King: I mean, I’m Airbnb all the way. Like when we go away, even my partner, we jot around, we do two, three nights, we see a whole country, we move about. And like the difference of quality in the trip is just through the roof. So, like, you know, I I get it because you know, I think it’s uh for me, it’s the it’s a better way to travel and it’s just a better way to see places. Yeah, I definitely couldn’t agree more. But you know what’s interesting though? See, see when you use Airbnb, you you you know, we’re we’re having this conversation because you know about Airbnb. You would be surprised because I go out and have conversations with people all the time. There’s still still a lot of people who don’t even know what Airbnb is and hybrid. That’s crazy. It’s crazy to us. But that’s what’s really exciting because the space and the opportunity is still huge.

[42:13] Sammie Ellard-King: It’s still growing and it’s still a gross tech business, it really is. Like it’s still got a lot of work to do in that in that space. Like what if if I’m thinking about this today, then like you you mentioned you know, you’ve got to take it seriously, especially with with regulation coming in, you know, someone who’s thinking about their their next business move and thinks that this is a good step for them, what’s it really take? It’s like any other business. I I wouldn’t say if we’re talking just purely from a business standpoint, it doesn’t because again, coming from the space that I come from, which is you know the the this this coaching space, you know, people will make you think that you’re able to, you know, start today and by tomorrow. Listen, Rodney, by this time, not even next year. This time next year, Rodney, we’re millionaires. Um but listen, we’re like we we understand you know, any business is going to take time. If you want to get any level of success from it, it’s going to take time. So I wouldn’t say it’s any different, you just have to be dedicated. The beauty about this is you’re able to grow it at a pace, you know, depending on what your current availability is. You know, so if you’re working right now, you can just start with one, you know, start to generate the income, start to really understand, um, start to really understand the product, understand how it works, understand your schedule and how you’re able to automate things around it, and then you get your second one, and then you do the same thing, then you get a third one. And then you get to a point where actually I’m making more money doing this than what I’m earning from from my job, and then you can make a decision. You know, it’s not something that you just have to jump all the way in. You you know, you’re really able to start and then scale and then grow it. So, but yeah, it takes dedication, it takes time, it takes focus. There’s no other way to put it. You’re gonna have to put time and energy into this. But if you do that, you know, the rewards truly are incredible.

[44:01] Sammie Ellard-King: It’s like anything, like you just gotta work it. Like, you know, and also one thing you said, like you start with one, actually, you want to fail. You probably want to like go and knock on a load of doors and get knocked back and understand what these nuances are because it’s the same with any kind of business. Failure is what teaches you how to be a better person. And you’re going to you’re you’re you’re going to. There’s there’s there’s no other way around it. Listen, I’m a pretty good coach. You know, my students are getting really good results, but you know, my students don’t speak to every single land of and get every single property. Like, no, that’s just not how business works or anything else works. You know, you have to go out there, you have to get the knockbacks, get the no’s, but the yeses are there. Why? Because there’s a whole bunch of people doing it who are getting yeses, right? But you have to go through all the no’s to get the yes. And it doesn’t matter even if you get your first 10 and they’re all yeses, trust me. That means the next thousand are gonna be no’s, right? This is just how it is. Like the no’s will be there. But but but that’s also the beauty, though. And that’s why you know entrepreneurship can be so easy for some people, because not easy in terms of you know the work you have to put in, because it doesn’t matter, you still have to work, but just easy in terms of your competition. People are lazy inherently, they don’t want to do the work. So it just frees up the space. If you’re willing to just do the work, that you will get success. It might not be in the first month, it might not be the first, second month, third month, fourth month. But if you just keep going and keep iterating, you know, you get okay, well, I’m gonna do this a little bit differently. I’m gonna that’s the difference. Because a lot of people start this journey and a lot of people fall off. But if you just keep going, you’re gonna get there.

[45:38] Sammie Ellard-King: 100%, man. It’s the one, two, or even the 10% that stick at it. It’s resilience and iterating. 100%. That’s what business is about, man. And as long as you’ve got the minerals to keep going. Last question for you, really, man, was. Like you mentioned about doing it outside of your nine to five, like a lot of people listen to this or sitting in there, you know, on their way to work right now thinking about ways that they can grow. Everybody’s banging on about side hustles. Is it something that you can build out about it? You know, is it something that you can actually really build whilst working in a in a corporate job, or or does it really require like four 100%?

[46:23] Ibrahim Braimah: It depends on skill. It depends on skill. Can you have one or two on the side while you’re working? Yes. Can you have three, four? Yes. But like you can’t, it’s you can’t build a big business out of this while you got an anti-five hour. So you just can’t. Like, I don’t you can build a team, you can build a team, but then who’s gonna be paying for the team? So it all depends. There’s different ways to scale. So you can scale, so my goal is I want to replace my income, which means, okay, cool. At some point you’re gonna have to make a decision as to, you know, whether you want to jump out or you get to that, you know, three or four, and you say, okay, I’m just gonna stick at this. Or if you want to scale it, you can then say, okay, cool, well, how long am I happy to keep working for? Because I’m gonna have to reinvest this money into bringing someone else in to carry on the acquisition and to carry on the daily management while I keep making money, which means obviously the revenue I’m gonna be getting from the business is not gonna be that much because I’m having to invest in someone. But ultimately, if they can do that and the business continues to grow, then I’m gonna get back to that profitability as well over a period of time. So that’s another way to do it. Or you quit your job and say, okay, cool, now I’m at this level of profitability, I’m not gonna jump all the way in and I’m gonna take this business to the next level. So there’s two different ways you can do it. You just have to make a decision, but you can’t just keep scaling this bad boy while you’re doing it. Listen, don’t listen to the hype. It’s nonsense. You can’t get to 10k a month in this business while you’re doing it’s not it’s not really gonna run. That’s just the truth. Unless you get two or three really, you know. So for example, I’ve got you know one of my units that generates me 3k profit per month, and you get free of them, it doesn’t take me any more work, right? Um, but it’s just that’s the location, that’s the profitability in that location. Okay, cool. You get free of them, you know, you own 10. Okay, that’s fine, right? But not everyone, like that one is actually one which is which is a rent to rent. That’s one that I’ve actually invested um with that landlord. Because I can. If you’re starting off, you haven’t got an investment, you don’t need to, but but I can. So I and you and the rent on that property by itself is 3k a month. So that’s like, oh, you know, if you don’t get profitable that month, you gotta find 3K from somewhere. Yeah, so so so there’s this this is this is what we’ll talk about. We spoke about risk earlier on. There’s this element of cool, is it risk? But if you understand what you’re doing, you’ve done your analysis correctly, you know the numbers in that area. Is it really risky? No. But someone else looking at it from the outside who maybe doesn’t have that same level of experience, then yes, 3K a month commitment, no matter what happens, obviously then sounds um a little bit more risky. So, yes, you know, people, but people will use that example and then say, yes, 10k a month, you only need a few couple properties, and that’s it. And you can still be doing this, it’s a side hustle. Like, no, like the that that the likelihood of that is is very, very slim.

[49:18] Sammie Ellard-King: Cool. That’s exactly what I wanted to know because I think a lot of people will probably end up asking you that question. So hopefully that uh hopefully that answers it for people. But yeah, if people are interested in coming in and joining, learning from you, coaching, what’s the best way, man? Yeah, so Success Blueprint Academy, the best way is just to follow me on my socials: TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, and every single one of them, I’ve got a link in my bio. You can actually get some free training. I’ve got a free training which you know everyone can just learn because look, you know, sometimes people just want to come in and get understanding, you know. Um obviously my time is precious and limited. Um obviously for my students, they get a lot of my time. But you know, outside of that, I’ve got the coaching business, I’ve got my own businesses that I’m running as well. But if people just want to come in and just learn about the space, then you know they can go and do that. And then if they really want to, you know, get to work with me closer, then they can just book a Kawhi team, have a conversation, see if we’re a good fit, and then if we are, then we can have a conversation as to you know how they can join the team as well. Um, but yeah, just my socials, best way.

[50:21] Sammie Ellard-King: Amazing, man. We’ll leave links to everything uh in the links below. But uh really appreciate your time. Thank you for coming on. I stand it’s been an absolute pleasure. Thank you for having me. I really enjoyed the conversation, top man.