Ian Dempsey: The Financial Adviser Who Was Secretly Broke

[0:00] Sammie: It’s so nice to see you again. Yeah. Um, I always love having you on, and I think we connect like on a human level. I think a lot of like what the struggles that we go through as business owners, yeah, uh, we both go through and we resonate, we sort of hold each other up when the other one’s not feeling as good about things, which is awesome. But by day, you’ve got financial advisor hat on. But back in the day, you were secretly in credit card debt, you were living paycheck to paycheck, you’ve got the actual shame that you have sort of spoken about publicly that was attached to that. How does someone whose day-to-day is basically fixing people’s finances have that happen to them with their money?

[0:43] Ian: It’s it’s gradual over a period of time, and and for me, relating back to like the episode that you had when Neil was on, and you said this like similar things, it all started around that uni moving away from home and just get all this money trucked at you and just going absolutely crackers with it and spending it on all kinds of stuff that I just didn’t need that I felt made me happy, and then it just kept going and going and going. And you get to a point, I didn’t really have that tipping point until I mean really honest, mate. Probably about five, six years ago, I sort of been a financial advisor for a long time, and and I it was roundabout lockdown, and the social media side of things started to really take off, and I was talking about it, and I’m like, I’m telling people to do stuff that I’m not doing myself, yeah. Like, get a grip on this, and it wasn’t like I’d got some degree of control by that point, but I just felt like a massive hypocrite. And initially it was like, ah, well, I’ve said that and I’m not really doing it, and then it just got bigger and bigger and bigger, and I got up on like this. I need to walk the walk and talk the talk, and it was a real moment of stop spending money on stupid stuff, stop buying new golf clubs, stop wasting your money on like two, three takeaways a month, all the little bits, and and the the big penny drop moment, funny enough, was when I switched bank accounts, and I moved from a traditional bank account to Stalin, which I love, I think they’re incredible, and there was all the spaces, and I and I’d watched a demo of it by um maybe on YouTube actually, and I’d just started splitting out and budgeting everything that we’ve got. And I said to the missus, I’m like, we need to change our bank account. This is what we should be doing. Let’s budget everything out for the kids. This, this, this, this went through it, set it up, got to the end of the month, had a blind panic because there was money left in the account. I’m like, with Mr. Direct Debit, went through everything. I’m like, that’s how much money we’re wasting every month on just existing and not being proactive and organised enough.

[2:42] Sammie: Yeah. There’s a study uh by uh someone at Harvard University, and uh there’s a psychologist and a scientist did this to basically unpack how people handle money. So why I’m so big on Monzo Pots. Same concept. It’s they gave um people a certain amount and they had to stash the money. Uh half the group had to put it in one pot, another group had four pots which they could attribute the money to. Now, the at by the end of the month, how much had those two sets of individuals saved versus the ones that had it in one pot? And uh it was 78% higher over the course of a year when it was split up and given jobs. Um, just simply because of the simple awareness of this money is for X, Y, and Z. This money is for X, Y, and Z. That’s why I talk about the three bank system all the time. It’s worked wonders for me. Um, it’s kind of a a UK spin on prosperity consciousness by Frederick a guy called Frederick Lehman. Really interesting book. His is eight, which is just ridiculous for most people. Um, you don’t need eight, and Americans are a bit different because they’ve got all these mental like rough rays and all these different accounts, right? So you don’t need all of that. But like just by doing that and giving your money a job, as you’ve just articulated so well, one, it’s really easy to do. How long did it take you to set that starting up?

[4:05] Ian: Like 10 minutes? Yeah, because like you’ve got the banking guarantee in place now, haven’t you? Where you switch your bank account, they’ll change all your direct debits, all your payments, everything. And even I worked in banking for 15 years and I was sceptical of how this guarantee would work. And within a week, everything was done. Cards, pin numbers, every payment, every past payment that paid someone was there. And and I think the the real thing for me was naming those pots whatever you wanted to and putting a picture on them. Putting the picture, I like that. And I use this with clients, right? All the time. And I said, like, who do you manage your bank account with? One of the last bits of conversation I have with them with a with a meeting is who are your banking accounts with? Have you thought of having them somewhere else? This is a pot system, and everybody’s like, Wow, I didn’t know that existed. Do it, change it, make a difference. But the the one example I use is we the the dog needs a groom every six weeks. Picture of the dog on there, dog groomers. So whenever the dog groomer comes up, there’s money in it to pay the dog groomer. And it was just a silly example that I used, but everybody remembers it. Because they ever got a dog, yeah, yeah, and it makes a big difference, huge, like even kids’ haircuts and stuff. Like we went minute detail on it. Oh, you went super grand in there? Yeah, yeah. Interesting. Like um, every September the the football subs for the kids were due. They’d need a new pair of football boots, they’d need a new pair of school uniforms, so there’d be a school uniform pot, there’d be a football pot, there’d be a Christmas pot. There was um a dog green pot. There’s a there was a takeaway pot. There was a holiday. If we booked a holiday, name of the holiday, um, with a picture of the hotel with stain on there as well. Every single thing was just in there, and it made such a difference. Yeah. Such a difference. Because it’s automatically you don’t think about it.

[5:39] Sammie: Yeah, it’s the automation, right? That’s that was gonna be my second point. Was like it’s just like it’s automatic, just set it up, and you know how much is gonna go in there, and it just happened, and you can see it tick up. And you the good thing about Monzo, um, I don’t know if Starline offers this as well, but on certain amount of pots, so the bigger ones, so for example, Christmas and stuff like that, we turn on roundups on our spending, so that was huge, because that’s actually quite a lot for us over a joint account for across a year. And then the second part is is it earns interest? So it’s like it’s like a savings account. So it’s earning interest as well, um, which is just class. Like we’ve got five, um, and it changes sometimes and throughout the year, and then I have two personally as well. So seven in total across sort of all of our accounts, and it just makes my life 20 times easier because you know these things are happening, yeah. Whether or not you like it or not, you’re gonna pay for it somehow. And you better not try and get that on credit cards out or like go put yourself in a sticky situation or have to ring someone up to borrow money because you can’t afford X, Y, and Z. Um, there’s 11 million people are predicted in 2026 to go into debt to pay for Christmas. Wow. And I think that a large part of that can be solved by setting that up in January and paying 20 quid, 30 quid a month into your Christmas pot, right?

[7:02] Ian: Yeah, yeah. And there’s no surprise, like we did the MOC for the cards, everything. And and what I love about them now, they’ve now evolved to have virtual cards. Yeah, yeah. So, like I was saying to you outside, like I went on holiday with my mates, like there’s there’s two of us, three of us went to a bather, and uh every everyone’s like, I’ll get this one, I’ll get that one. And then we clocked it all up at the end. And then I got back from holiday and I’m like, we should have just had a virtual card. Everybody put a lot of money in, and then it’s all you don’t have to fanny around doing that. And I think it’s so clever to do that. We set the kids up with them as well, so we could have a kite account so you could see where they were spending all their money, and it just got them in the habit of doing a similar thing. Oh, that’s cool. I got two out of four in the habit of doing that. The other two are just like it comes in and it goes, it’s like bits a hole in their pocket, which is exactly like I was like at that age as well.

[7:46] Sammie: Yeah, yeah. You know, you can’t, you can’t. Some people just wire differently, aren’t they? Yeah, but I think that paycheck to paycheck mentality then starts to shift when you just set these things up, right? And would you say that since you’ve done that, that your relationship with money do you feel a little bit more at ease?

[8:06] Ian: Yeah, like I’ve I’ve resigned myself to the fact that I’m never gonna be perfect with money, and that’s kind of rich coming from someone who does what I do. But I don’t think anybody is. I’m fucking terrible, man. And you’re never gonna have a 10 out of 10. Do you know what I mean? No, I’m awful. And there’ll be times and there’ll be times of the month where I’ll be like load of client fees lying in it, they can’t. I’m like, oh well, we’ll we’re great, we’re loaded, let’s go to the pub, let’s do, let’s do something to celebrate that we’ve done that. And then like the next day you wake up, I’m like, was that really worth it? Sometimes yes, sometimes no. But I’m always gonna have those battles, and it’s just having those little things in in in place, like Amazon now over lockdown, terrible on Amazon, bye-bye, bye, bye, bye. And before you know, it’s gone. Prime Day was just like Christmas in our house. Really? Okay. Oh, like I’ve never been that on it, but I don’t know why. We got sucked in once and I just started a new job, got a pay rise, and it was like I doubled my pay. I think I’d gone from like 60k a year to 125 grand a year, which was which was nuts for this effectively the same job. We had all this extra money coming in, prime day came around, we’re going on holiday to Disney World, and I’m like, we need new suitcases, and I want this, and we need that, and the other. And it just kept like the till register in my head was just going ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding ding. And it I can still do that, but like my other half now is is is getting a lot better challenging me. Like if she starts seeing like more than like the average number of Amazon passes, like little bits coming through, she’s like, You alright? You are you okay? Because I’m an emotional spender. Like if I feel down about something, I’ll I’ll spend a bit of money.

[9:39] Sammie: Yeah, yeah, I’m the same. What’s really helped me, mate, is I got um I now have a guilt-free spending pot. Yes. And so the Amazon, it can be anything. I just like last month at the top, I got myself Arsenal shirt and I have a farm shop pot because I’m a nutcase for food. Like I’m really on my food. I went down a whole rabbit hole about like quality of meat from supermarkets, what goes in them, and all of this stuff. And I since then, obviously, a lot of supermarkets have have improved and they’re a bit more open and honest about these things, but even so, I’m farm shops, butchers, grown green grocers because I just like buying local. It’s my thing. That’s that’s what I you know. I’m not going out waxing hundreds of pounds on Tuesday night in a club anymore. It’s not my vibe, like farm shops and organic food. I don’t know why. It’s my thing. Um, so that is my pot. And I’m allowed to blow it like completely guilt-free. Uh no, the missus can’t say anything about it. It’s like it’s a matter of if it’s an arsenal shirt or a bit of food or a new camera or something. I can emotionally buy myself a pair of trainers if I’m feeling down on a Sunday morning as long as it’s in the pot. And just by doing that has sort of given me like that level of like, I’ve got that, I can put the foot down, and I can also, and when it’s run out, I’m like, oh, it’s run out. No, I have to wait. Yeah. And it just gives me that friction, which I think is so hard in this day and age because of like digitised money, right? Like, you just don’t feel anything, do you, when you like pay? So it’s easy done.

[11:11] Ian: And and do you know what like when you were saying that, the one thing that really got me on track for this stuff was I remember when I worked at HSBC, I’d moved from Santander, got a decent pay rise, worked in literally the the the the brand shop was it. I was single at the time, had the two kids on a Wednesday and on a weekend, and I’m like, I’d get to the end of the month and it’d be literally that last week, there’d be naught left. Bills would be paid, but everything would be fine. And I’m like, I’ve got a nice suit on, I’ve got a nice watch, I’ve been sucked into the lifestyle, I’m driving a brand new prepping Mercedes out the front. Everyone’s like, Oh, I love your car. And part of me’s like, Yeah, but I’m fucking skinty. Yeah. And and I did the brown envelope thing. I right. I was like, how am I gonna do this? And I thought, right, this is what I’m gonna do. Because when we first had kids, I did it and it worked then. So I thought, oh, it might work again. Did the same thing and just and and broke a lot of that habit straight away and just took me cash out on payday, made sure there’s enough direct debits in there, put it all into envelopes. I I think it’ll be a lot harder to do that now because not many places will, not as many places will be accepting as cash, but you were I was consciously aware of when I was spending a 10 at five or a 20 quid. Right. The first couple of weeks I was still just like, oh yeah, fine, fine, fine, fine, fine. And then I got the point where I’m like, every day this week I’ve handed over seven, eight quid to go and get a meal deal or something else. I’m just gonna make sandwiches home. Every month at the end of the month when this money would come in, I’d go and buy a new shirt for a night out, and I’d be like, I’ve got a wardrobe full of them. And it just became almost obsessive to the point. And I’m like, well, if I don’t spend that, I’ll have 250, 300 quid left at the end of the month, and then me and the kids can go to like Thor Park or do something. And and that’s made a massive difference. I would be I think it’d be difficult to do that now, though. You retrained yourself, but it was horrible, it was horrible. I hated every single moment of it. But after doing it for two months, I was like, I’m aware of what I’m spending and where that money goes.

[13:03] Sammie: 100%, man. We just put um uh it will be out by the time this comes out. So I’ll drop a link to it below. But we’ve just done like a full like deep dive into the kind of digitization of money, and it it it even people might be like yawn and boring. But it’s actually really interesting, like how um much we more we spend now because of contactless, because of uh even with chip and pin, even with the swipe when you used to have to sign. Um, it’s all these steps, and they’ve spent billions and billions of pounds, and we go into detail about like the where the change has happened and what how much has increased their obviously e-commerce and social media play a massive part in this, but they’ve spent like billions and billions of pounds and tons and tons of hours of researching your trigger points to stop you from feeling bad about spending money. Right. And so you get to the today’s point where today I’ve done it already. I haven’t even looked, but I know I was in uh Costa and I went in Sainsbury’s, I picked up a few things. I couldn’t tell you how much I spent because I haven’t got a £4.30 in my pocket to show you. Do you know what I mean? So it’s like back in the day, you would really feel that pain, that friction, and we don’t have that anymore. And so that’s why like a big part of what we’re doing with gains is like giving you visibility and and you know, pots and spaces really do help that. That’s kind of the amplification of it, I think.

[14:28] Ian: Well, uh funny enough, I heard about McDonald’s and why they’ve got the the machines. Have you heard this?

[14:32] Sammie: Yeah.

[14:32] Ian: So it’s because you’re you’re more likely to spend more on a machine than you would do with a person at the counter. Because you don’t feel guilty. Yeah. And and and like I can see it. Like I’ve taken the kids to McDonald’s, and I’m still like all school to want to go up the front, buy whatever I want, and then come out. But they’re just like tap, tap, tap, tap, tap, and before you know it, that order’s gone through the roof. And I’m like, yeah, very, very clever, but very subtle. And I hadn’t even twigged that’s why they had them in, and then and then someone told me, and I’m like, wow, that makes a lot of sense.

[14:57] Sammie: So the delivery apps is 34% more per order than if you phoned up or you went in store because you’re not dealing with that human being. You had to have that shame of like, should I get the spring rollers and the porn crackers on top? Basically, so you buy them, yeah, which is nuts, right? So the brown envelope method helped you out of it. Yeah. Was there anything else that you did that really sort of brought that into play and made you a bit more aware around these things?

[15:23] Ian: The conversations daily with clients about what I was doing, about what they were doing, how they were surrounded by money, like dealing with people that were building wealth and investments and pensions and tax plan and all that stuff. And I became really blasé to money. Like it was almost like uh if I go to a builder’s house, like there might be incredible builders, but there’s always unfinished jobs around the house, and it felt kind of similar. But I would use that as the reason. I’m like, ah, I deal with it every day, it’s fine, don’t worry about it, you’ll be okay. Just kept pushing it back, pushing it back, pushing it back, and then it got to a point where I’m like, I’ve got nothing in my pension, I’ve got nothing in savings, I’ve got nothing in investments. On the face of it, I’m living the successful life, but behind closed doors, anything but and it was and then I’ve had then I had it the other way where when I set the business up, I had like three three like incredible months, my first three months at the level that I would only dream about. I was at 23k month, a 25k month, and a 28k month, my first three months of giving financial advice to a separate business. Um, and I was like, this is it. I’m I’m this is all I’ve ever wanted. The first month, I was like, this is all I ever wanted. And I got to the end of the third month and I and I was broken. And it was such an odd feeling. Because I went for a game of golf, came back, my phone had been pinging all morning because I’d had a social media post on LinkedIn go nuts. Nobody’s in the house, sat down, and I burst into tears. Like literally broke down, and I’m like, oh my, this isn’t what it was cracked enough to be.

[16:54] Sammie: No, no, it’s weird, isn’t it?

[16:56] Ian: You’re on it, but you don’t get it, it comes, you’re like, and like if someone had said to me, like when I first started in France, my first job in financial services, um first regulated run of financial services was a mortgage broker for Britannia Bun Society, 25 grand a year, and I’d done that in my first month of going self-employed. I was like, I’ve made it. And then the second month and the third month, and and what really hit me was I can do that and I can have that all again. But the kids were coming back from school and the tea wasn’t ready. The missus was like, When are you gonna come in? Like, are you gonna finish? And I’m like, If I don’t if I don’t make money, when I got unpaid at the end of the month, I can’t pay the mortgage. And there was a real kind of penny drop moat. I’m like, it was like path A or path B. Do you want the 25, 28k months? If you do, this is what you’ve got to get up, or do you want something different? And I and I chose the other one, and it was really like I got a coach. I was I coached through it as well because I just felt like I can’t figure this out on my own.

[18:36] Sammie: So why did you yeah, you’re well known for calling the industry the grey supergrade, which actually cracked me up. And anyone I actually say that to I always credit you back for for saying it because they laugh when they say that. It’s usually financial advisors because they’re coming in their grey suits, and I’m like, hey, lovely, love it. Yeah, but you were in the big restricted firms, right? You were doing like the kind of this is our way or the not the highway or the no way kind of vibe. And um what made you see it on the inside there and then go, no, I need to, we need to be like open and everyone, and there’s not one way fits all.

[19:15] Ian: I I just felt like a cog in a in a massive machine. Started off in banking. When I started giving regular advice, it was it was at Santander, loved that job, great team, big fire movie belly. But I was seeing like 35 to 40 appointments a week on busy like end of tax year, your diary would be full with eight, nine, ten appointments a day. So it was high volume, high pressure, ultra compliant. But it what it made me realise over time was there’s little creativity in this. You’re just following a process, follow the process, this much input will give you that much output, follow it our way, and you’ll be fine. And then I was made redundant from Santander, moved to HSBC, slightly more sophisticated proposition, inheritance tax plan, and a few other bits, and then three to four year mark again. I’m like, is this what I’m gonna be doing for the rest of my life? And and I and I think in those networks and arenas, you can almost become institutionalized at the four or five year mark because you’ve got the company car, you’ve got the laptop, you’ve got the bonuses, you know your client portfolio, golden handcuffs, becomes easier, but then as it becomes easier, you get more responsibility and sucked into more and more stuff. And I thought if I don’t go out now, then I’m never gonna do it. Move to another um big network at the time, which was another big step up, and then I just got to the point where I’m like I either need one more roll of the dice, which is gonna be completely independent, or I need to get out completely. And I rolled the dice away independent and haven’t looked back. Obviously, I stun through a separate business, but um how long ago was that? And it it’s it’s made a monumental difference, but I still feel like a bit of a square peg and a round hall in the regulated space, and I think and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that either, because I’ve positioned myself to to be like that, yeah.

[21:02] Sammie: But that’s what makes you you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because you’re like, no, well, no, like we’re not fighting against what I think is actually probably not right for most people. Yeah, actually, being a square peg is what gives you that red bird in a sea of green birds kind of approach, but they’re all still the same species. So it’s like I think it’s really, really important. But be straight with me, is the average person in the UK well served by financial advice? Has it got better? Has it got worse in your eyes, do you think?

[21:38] Ian: That’s a that’s a hard question to answer. And and the reason it’s hard is because the FC have made some incredible changes over the years to um cut the bottom of the industry out, if you like, requalifying changes have come in, consumer duty, but fundamentally, I still think there’s a there’s a level of wealth that is is underserved and let down by that regulated industry, and that is where the whole finfluencing space has come come through and filled that gap much better than financial advice has ever been able to do. And and I think in that space there’s a there’s this intense competition between the regulated space and oh look at these clowns on social media, as you know, like it gets very, very heated in a lot of conversations. Um but then they all want to come on this show. Mate, exactly this. And the other part of that is, right? If if that gap didn’t exist in the first place and you were serving those clients properly, yeah, that would never have opened up. But the reality of it is like a lot of the people in that wealth category, and I’m gonna and then the numbers are probably like under 200k plus. So if you’ve got under 200,000 pounds in wealth, then typically Get financial advice, you might be going to an IFA who’s just kind of started in the process, or you might you’d be using a uh restricted proposition, and there’s nothing wrong with either, by the way. But it’s it’ll still be a sales process, yeah, and a process that you’ve got to go through. And I think well, most don’t take you if you even got 100 grand. Correct. HSBC, our cutoff was 250, like anything less than 250, you couldn’t walk through that.

[23:10] Sammie: Savings and investments as well, isn’t it?

[23:12] Ian: Investable assets, yeah. Or you had to or you had to be in a more than 100 grand, and that was like 10, 10 odd years ago. But that price point has only gone higher and higher and higher and higher over a period of time. But I still think there’s a there’s a solution in that space, and I and I probably don’t think it’s transactional financial advice, like hand on heart, and I think that’s gonna be incredibly damaging to a lot of people, a lot of that operate in this space.

[23:38] Sammie: I think it’s changing a touch. AI is probably gonna end up solving a large part of that for a lot of people, giving them access to the advice that you know people are getting with 250k plus. But for the everyday person on social media, as you said, like for influencers popping up and and doing their thing. I mean, that’s literally my business is helping people go from I’ve got fuck all now. How do I go and get to my first 100k? It’s basically why I exist.

[24:08] Ian: And that’s the bit we’ve let down as an industry, because we’ve been like, well, I’m not gonna tell you how to get a mortgage, I’m not gonna tell you how to sort you down, I’m not gonna tell you how to do all these other mental blocks that you’ve got that you can’t start investing. I’m gonna see when you’ve got 150, 200 grand in your bank account.

[24:23] Sammie: Yeah, or mumsy or dad.

[24:25] Ian: Which I also understand, right? Because if you’re running your own business, you want to make sure your business is going to be profitable.

[24:31] Sammie: But well, yeah. An expensive calculator in a suit in a lot of ways.

[24:37] Ian: Yes, absolutely.

[24:39] Sammie: What separates a generally good advisor? If someone’s out there looking for an advisor now, what separates a generally good one from a bad one, in your opinion?

[24:47] Ian: I think a lot of the challenges that there’s not enough financial advisors available within the UK. So when individuals typically reach out to a financial advisor, I’d be very surprised if they reach out to more than two, three. But actually, like if you met 100 people in a pub, not every single person in that pub is gonna be your best mate. You need to find the person that you’re comfortable working with and keep searching until you do. Because you the right financial advisor will make a massive difference to what um you’re gonna get out of your life financially. But actually, what I say with a lot of clients is if you get to the point where you don’t need me anymore and you can do this stuff yourself, I’ll be the happiest man alive.

[25:27] Sammie: Yeah.

[25:28] Ian: Because my job’s worked, and I’ve got clients like that now, and they’ll turn around and say, Well, yeah, but we’ve worked with you for five, ten years, we’ll like what you do, we want it, we want that security of knowing that you’re there and knowing that we’re not going to make the mistakes. But I think good to bad, very, very different depending on the environment that you’ve brought up in, right? Like, if I if I use the example of myself in those restricted spaces, the financial advice that I was given was was at a high standard in the parameters of that space. If I compare that advice to what I would give now as an independent, it it’s night and day. Night and day. Like there was there’d be so much more I could do now than I could have done then.

[26:11] Sammie: Yeah. And obviously some people will argue completely the opposite because they kind of have to. Um, but you’re seeing this from like, I’ve been in this game 20 plus years and this is what I’m seeing.

[26:21] Ian: Yeah. Yeah. Like for me, it’s it’s it’s it’s never about a sales pitch. Like if you sit down in front of an advisor and you’re getting or anybody and you’re getting a sales pitch, like red flag straight away, what are they trying to sell me? Or are they really interested in me? Um, it’s someone who’s gonna listen to you more than they’re gonna talk. It’s gonna be have those human conversations, it’s the goals-based stuff, it’s not about the how much have you got coming in and going out. And from a regulatory perspective, I get it right, you’ve got to fill a form in, it’s a fact-find, due diligence on the client to make sure they can afford everything. I understand all that. But having the deep conversations with a client and not being on the clock when you do it, and what I mean by that is like if you’re expected to complete an appointment in an hour and a half and you’ve got to have all of these things done, and you get 25 minutes in, you feel like you know any, you’ve got to you’ve got to get it done because you’ve got 35 appointments that week. Taking your time with clients and really understanding them makes a huge difference. I’ve lost count of the amount of people I’ve sat in front of that said, we were really put off with other FAs, or we’ve had a bad experience, and I’ve had two this week. And if we’ve got time, I’ll go into what what’s happened with them. Um, we just felt like we were gonna have to do this ourselves and we didn’t know where to turn, and we’re glad we’ve come across what you do.

[27:35] Sammie: I want to talk to you about those because I think they’re interesting for people because I’m sure people there’s some shocking nuts things. You go on Reddit forums, it’s like, what the hell? But uh good friend of ours. Um the reason why I I speak about this is because you you I think you hit the nail on the head there. Um, good friend of ours, Neil, Neil Invest, he was on the show, had a chat with you recently, and he said to me that like you got to the end of the 90 minutes and you hadn’t spoken about money once. There wasn’t one thing about money in there, it’s all about the human where do you want to go, where do you want to be, what are the type of goals you want for your life, like whereas in there you didn’t ask him like how much he was making, was how’s the business doing, all of these things. You were just asking him, like, I want to get to know you. And I think like that is probably because every imagine you see this at 35 people a week. Every single one of them is completely different. Like, every single one. There’s no one gonna be the same.

[28:30] Ian: But the process wasn’t in that environment. That’s the difference. Process driven. It was, I mean, here’s a lovely brochure. This tells you how great the company is that I work for. Here’s a little bit about investing. Let’s get started. Sign this form before you start. Numbers, numbers, numbers, numbers. I’ll see you next week and I’ll give you a recommendation. And it was 99% the same, 99% of the time. Whereas, and for me, it was again this is a whole square peg round whole thing that I talked about. When I went out on my own, I thought I’ve got to do this differently. Because if I don’t do this differently now, I’m gonna get four or five years in, and everything will be on the line in terms of like what we’re doing as a family, and I’ll have fallen out of love with it again. And it was just the reprogramming, relearning of what to have those conversations properly with clients.

[29:19] Sammie: Yeah. How could you not love like finding out like people and like watching them what makes some tick and like turning that into like great habits and a really great plan and watching their life change because of it? Like it just seems so logical when you take a step back and think about it. A good friend of uh a show, Andy Hart, like he talks about this all the time. He’s like, I couldn’t I couldn’t get care less about what you’ve been doing until this point. He’s like, You are that person, that’s what’s happened. Yeah great. Now let’s sort of out where do you want to bloody get to? Because I can help you with that, can’t help you with what you’ve done before, yeah, but I can help you on the next step. And I can’t understand that unless I can understand you and where you want to be. And so he’s like, most of the time, and then you know, what am I really gonna teach you? Sort your pension out, do a stocks and shares ISAs, a few tax little planning things here and there, and you’ve got some extra cash, maybe from an inheritance or a business sale. But other than that, right, just need to understand you.

[30:15] Ian: And it was a real eye-opener for me when I started doing that. Because all of a sudden, those conversations with clients, even existing clients that I’d looked at for three or four years, all of a sudden were oh, actually, Ian, you know what? I’m worried about this, and I’m worried about that, or I’ve got a savings account that I didn’t tell you about, or there’s there’s so much comes out in it, and I think it should feel different, and it should feel uncomfortable in in the 20 odd years of doing this. Since I started doing that, I’ve had clients burst into tears, like five or six burst into tears and be like, I feel like I’ve had weight just taken off in an hour. I wouldn’t have taken that weight off in one of those other environments where I’m not having those conversations at all. It would have been a product pitch, and there’s the advice and set it up and set it up, which is which is still right for some people, don’t get me wrong.

[31:02] Sammie: You get like, do you get it? Do you think anyone needs advice then? Because I I I struggle with this. I’m like, you don’t, yeah, I don’t think you do. I don’t think you should be paying for one until a certain point. Do you agree with that sentiment, or do you think that everyone should have some level of financial advisor?

[31:23] Ian: I think everybody should have some kind of goal setting experience and a real dig into actually what do you want to get out of life, Sammie? Like, why does it matter? Tell me. Silence and just let the client talk. Because we’re we’re so ready, like in that environment, we’re like three, four steps ahead already. Like you say something, and I was like trying to be three, four steps ahead. Oh, well, if he says this, I’m gonna go down this route and that route. Like, no, have someone that can help you set some real goals about what you want to get out of life, even if it scares the crap out of you. And like you and I both know, like writing goals down and planning these goals makes a massive difference to the outcome that you’re gonna get at the back end.

[31:59] Sammie: Oh mate, and they change all the time as well. This year all the time.

[32:02] Ian: Absolutely, everybody should have that. Yeah, I think everybody should have some degree of financial planning. Yeah. And that might be here you are now, based on the goals that you’ve said. This is what your goals are gonna look like in 10 years’ time, this is the path to get you there, this is what you do tomorrow. This is what you do in three months, five months, ten months. These are returns you need to get. This is how much you should have by five years’ time. Map that all out, and that would be good enough for most people. Um, but sometimes people, like I said, pay for the confidence and security of knowing that actually someone’s looking after me and doing this properly to make sure that I’m gonna be okay. Should everybody have financial advice? No. Should some of the people that have got financial advice right now have financial advice or unfinancial advice, no. But they should have some degree of planning and goal setting and then make the decision on whether you want to take that on and do it yourself.

[32:50] Sammie: Yeah.

[32:51] Ian: Because if you can understand those goals and what you’ve got to do step by step, exactly like you said with Andy there, it’s not massively complicated.

[32:58] Sammie: No.

[32:59] Ian: There you go, there’s your plan. You need to put £250 a month into your ISA, you need to make sure you get a return higher than 6%, you need to do that for the next 15 years, and you’re gonna be lying on a beach by the time you’re 50. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And even then, clients are skeptical because it’s like, oh, well, things could change up and down and all the rest of it. That’s why we use modest returns. That’s why we’re not saying 10, 12%, S&P 500 for the old world, we’re talking about like five or six or seven percent, so that you’ve got a bit of fat in there in case things drop off.

[33:25] Sammie: Yeah, yeah. And that’s where you’re like, and then they get then it’ll be like, Ian, I want to buy a new house. And then you have to go, great. Well, if you do that, it’s gonna raise your cost by this, you haven’t got a pay rise, and da da da, that’s gonna affect your plan by list, then you can do it, but here’s why, right? Like, and then that then it’s like then they go, uh love, we’re moving in three years, not next year. You know, so like that that’s where the financial advisor is like for me is like super powerful. It’s like, I’m thinking about doing this, thinking about buying a Porsche, thinking about buying a new car, thinking about going on this big holiday or second home in France. Well, yeah, you can, but here’s the cost of it. Yep. And having that sounding board, right, for those big life decisions.

[34:11] Ian: And I and I think it’s it’s I say the same thing to every client. Like at the on-boarding stage, I think I say if you think of a question about money, I want you to pick the phone up. Or if you’ve got any that thing that you’re concerned about financially, pick the phone up. If I don’t know the answer, I know somebody who will. Like, I want you to pick up the phone up if you get made redundant, if you’ve got a pay rise coming up, a bonus, some RSUs, you get some kind of new pension scheme at work, pick the phone up, have a conversation, set up a new business, buy a new car, pick the phone up, let’s have a conversation because it makes a difference.

[34:39] Sammie: Yeah, yeah, I do it now. I do it now. Yeah, I have sounding boards.

[34:44] Ian: You need yeah, and as an advisor, I need it too. And and that’s one of the hard things about it is and and and running a business as a business owner, like it can be very lonely. Yeah. And I mean, I say that, but missus always keeps me in check, right? I’ll I’ll have a great idea and I’ll be sat in the office and I’ll be thinking about procrastinating about all kinds of stuff, but I’m off on a rabbit hole thinking about this great idea. I’m gonna do this, research it and all the rest of it, and then I get back in the house, she’s like, That’s a stupid idea. And I’m and I get really offended by it, and I was like, I’m not that’s a stupid idea. I’ve just spent hours looking at it, and then we’ll go out for a dog walk later, and she’ll be just having a chat with it. She’s like, Talk me through it. She knows exactly what she took me through it. Like, how’s it all gonna work? And blah blah blah blah blah. And then I’m like, two days later, I’m like, Yeah, that’s a stupid idea.

[35:27] Sammie: You know, but that sounded becomes steaming in the house, and I’m like, I thought of a new content idea. Do you want to hear it? She obviously like, no, but like, yeah, go on, because you know, I’m like, I’m gonna have she has to say yes. I’m like, What do you think? And she’s like, Yeah, yeah, yeah, good. I’m like, fuck. I just spent six hours on this, like, waste of a whole day. Yeah, I know it very well. Because she goes, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But if she goes, No, that’s actually genuinely good, then I’m like, okay, yeah, I’m hitting the nail on the head. Yeah, but that happens few and far between because I get too many ideas.

[37:07] Ian: Mate, like I spent the whole day on it. I’ve got drawers full of stuff in the office of like, I’ll have this for a content idea, I’ll do this for a content idea, and try loads of different things. A tech drawer of tech. Oh mate, like all blackboard, whiteboard, different lights, different all kinds of stuff. And I’m like, I buy them at the time with all the best intentions, and then three weeks later they’re just sat there doing it, doing nothing. And like again, better money management in the business could could get on top of that as well.

[37:31] Sammie: But like, you’re a human. You’re a human. Why do financial advisors like because it’s like you’re out there giving a lot away for free as well, like a lot of really brilliant advice, like your LinkedIn’s awesome, you’ve been active on social media, you go on podcasts, you talk about these things quite openly. You’re like kind of giving away a lot of the source for free that financial advisors gatekeep and put behind paywalls. Like, why why are you doing that? And what do you kind of get stick from financial advisors for doing that? You know, I certainly do, but like what what where where does where how do you feel about that? Because you’re kind of playing both sides.

[38:10] Ian: Yeah, I don’t get so much stick anymore. Like now I’m a little bit more established, and actually the other part of it is if I do like so what? Right. That’s a reflection of you. You’re giving me grief about talking to someone about something that you would have charged a client five grand for, and I’m telling them how to do it for free or in a cost-reduced way. Like, that’s not my problem. You’re clearly in a space where you’re fearful of what’s coming next, and AI and technology is really gonna have an impact on transactional financial advice, the boring, super simple stuff. Um I’ve lost my train of thought there, my apologies.

[38:47] Sammie: That’s alright. What was saying again? So you’re giving it away for free, yeah, but then you also have a business with it. How are you balancing the two?

[38:54] Ian: Given information. Somebody said to me a long time ago, and I can’t remember where it was, like, give 99% of what of what you know with free and hold back one percent. Zigzigla. And find the person and work with the people that want that 1%. Because we’ve we’ve, like you said, kept it behind a firewall for such a long period of time. And a lot of it isn’t mega complicated stuff. But we’re like, yeah, well, we’ll what should be we’ll charge you two grand for that for what would be nicer.

[39:21] Sammie: Do you know what they pay for? Is you and the accountability and steps. Like, I’ve given away anything you could possibly want to do with personal finance if we’ve not we’ve got an article on it, or we’ve done a podcast, or we’ve done a YouTube video or a social media short form. Probably covered it in four or five different angles if you really want to go that deep. Yeah. But what people pay for is people like, okay, here’s what I do today, and here’s the next plan for the next 90 days, and here’s all the videos that you need to watch or follow. And they will pay for that because it’s laid out for them and they’re like community and they’re like speaking to people and having that like that’s where it all comes in. But it’s all been it’s all on the internet.

[39:57] Ian: And some people like just want to hear that from a trusted voice. AI, in some ways, takes that trust away because you could just put it into AI and figure most of it out, but like But you don’t know if it’s right, that’s correct. But if that trusted voice then says something similar and maybe adds another layer on top of that, then all of a sudden you’ll take some action and maybe improve your finances one way or other. But for me at the time when I first started, like back in lockdown, there was nobody doing this stuff from it from a regulator’s perspective and talking about how to set up investments and what compound growth is, and it just feels like the it goes back to the whole financial education piece, doesn’t it? Like if I give everything away for free, if you use it, great. Happy days, if you want me to look after you and pay me a fee for doing it, happy days too.

[40:39] Sammie: Yeah, yeah, no, I get that. So for someone that’s doing it all themselves, um, perhaps they’re just getting started with a few of these things and they’re getting it into play, you know, there have been a couple of savings accounts and we looked at a lifetime ISO if they’re saving for a house or you know, just got uh pensions all consolidated. For someone that’s doing it all themselves, like genuinely, in your opinion, what’s some things that you know they can genuinely keep doing uh and what what do they need to do to sort of keep themselves on the right path? Some little steps and tricks that they can do.

[41:09] Ian: The regular check-ins. So actually, um the check-ins on your path to what your final goal is. So say save how for a house in five years type. In simple terms, if you want 35, 40 grand for a deposit on a house, like reverse engineer that back to how much you should have it each year or six months. To milestones, exactly that. And you can check in and give yourself that pat on the back. Because if like imagine somebody says, Sammie, you’ve got to save £100 a month for the next five years, and I’m not gonna tell you what for, but it’s gonna be for something really important, and I’m gonna give you no appraiser, all the rest of it. Like, as humans, we want that pat on the back. We want to be told, Yeah, do you know what you’re doing the right thing, and yes, it’s gonna get your house, but those check-ins make a massive difference. And verbalizing and writing stuff down makes a huge difference. That’s why I do this stuff in calls and in meetings with clients. Verbalize it. And the amount of times like a married couple says, You never told me that. Yeah, or I didn’t know that about you. And you’re like, Well, this is why we talk about it. Like, verbalizing makes a massive difference. Having that accountability with somebody else is a big thing as well. Like, if if it’s you and your partner, like talk to each other about this stuff, like I want to make sure in five years’ time we are living by the beach, right? Great, let’s reverse engineer that back. How are we gonna do that? When are we gonna check in? How often are we gonna talk about this stuff? Don’t talk about money all the time, concentrate it down into a really short window and have those conversations around finances. If you’re not having conversations around finances with your partner, you should be. And I get in some situations that’s stressful. Maybe there’s addiction, maybe there is gambling, maybe there are other things that impact on that, and it becomes challenging at a particular point in time. But having those conversations on a consistent basis make a massive difference and know your benchmarks and your goals, but the goals are the big one, man. Like, what are you going for? Yeah, like if you just want to, you wouldn’t just get in a taxi, say take me wherever you want, and that’s what you’re doing with your life. But if you got on a taxi and said, I want the house in five years’ time, and the taxi would take you there. Depending how drunk you are, they might take you around the houses, but they might take you the straight way to go and MACD’s on the way, but but at the same time, like no know what your destination is, yeah. And even if it feels like so scary and so far away that you’re never gonna get there, there’s nothing wrong with that because plans change.

[43:33] Sammie: I love that you said this. So, like, I’ve with the house, for example, I’m like, um, write it up on a board or something along those lines. Like, what was the visualization aspect that you can give yourself? And it’s like um your first one is like your first month, like you put £100 towards it. Let’s say that’s the amount that you know, work out you need to save over that year to hit that year goal. And it’s like the first hundred pounds, it’s like, yes, get in big tick next to it. Just do that like first little thing, first 50 quid in your stocks and shares ISA if you’re working out your retirement fund or whatever, and just like massively make a massive deal out of it. Cook your favourite meal that night or whatever that might well be. Just like give yourself something where it’s just a little gratification, like you you’ve you nailed it, mate, even though it you know full well it’s the first step, because it just makes such a difference. It helped me with debt, like getting out of that debt. It was that snowball method. People always talk about the avalanche being better because you save on your interests. Bollocks to that, I needed a cuddle. I needed a cuddle, I need to self-cuddle myself because I was self-sabotaging bad money habits up until that point. I needed a well done, Sammie, that one’s gone. And that got me out that got me out of it because I just gamified the whole thing.

[44:47] Ian: But that self-sabotage thing, like that was a real big thing for me. And and I and I see that a lot for other people as well when you’re having those conversations. Like, you’d you I’d I’d and you’ve been there, don’t I mean? You’ve got on a Friday night, you’d wake up in the morning with a raging hangover, you’d be 150 quid down, and you’d be like, What a fucking idiot. And then you get a phone call like two hours later, you’re about you’re coming out again tonight, you’d be like, Yeah, then you’re out again. And and it it it’s just a cycle that repeats itself. But like the conversations that I’d have with myself, I wouldn’t have them with anybody else because I wouldn’t dare talk to anybody like that, you know, and and and like my partner’s like an incredibly calm and like the yin and the yang, like she’s so well-centred and calm and supportive. And like if I’m going off on these mad kind of ideas and stuff, she just kind of reins it all back in. She’s like, Come on, back to reality, sunshine.

[45:37] Sammie: Yeah.

[45:38] Ian: Let you have your little bit of a dream.

[45:40] Sammie: Um, it’s really weird. We kind of do it through me and my partner kind of flip on each other. Right. So, like, she’s also quite can be quite like manic, multiple ideas, like self conscious. And then completely flips around when I’m like that. Right. And is that thing, and I do the same to her. Yeah. So it kind of, we’re both nut jobs, basically, in a nutshell. But um, it’s quite helpful. But having that some someone that you can soundboard those things with, life with, just man, car. I’d like I was thinking about it the other day. I was like, imagine if she wasn’t here. I’d be nuts. I’d be absolutely nuts. I don’t know, God knows where I’d be. Yeah. And so I think it’s really important.

[46:21] Ian: It’s the biggest financial decision of your life. I don’t think you should underestimate like how how important it is to be with the right partner.

[46:27] Sammie: Yeah.

[46:27] Ian: And I’ve been with the wrong people before. And you kind of like, you know, like that it’s the wrong person to be with, but you’re so entrenched in your life, you’re like, oh, we’ll just keep pushing through and we’ll just get to Christmas and we’ll just get to Easter and we’ll just do this.

[46:40] Sammie: And then all of a sudden it’s like Yeah, then it’s your birthday next month, so I can’t dump her then. Yeah.

[46:44] Ian: And then you come out of it and you’re like, Fosh, man, I’ve just wasted like 18 months of my life or even longer for a lot of people.

[46:49] Sammie: Yeah, man. Yeah. I I you know, I knew very quickly of this one, uh, and she’s an absolute superstar. And so I’m a very, very lucky man. But I wanted to ask you about your red golf thing, um, which I really like. And yeah, the red the red car theory is basically the underlying fact factor of it. Um, once you tune into your money, you spot opportunities everywhere. Is that kind of the crux of it? Absolutely.

[47:17] Ian: And it and it’s it’s getting that first step. Um, and it it’s the whole thing of like if you went out tomorrow and bought a red golf, how many other red golfs would you see driving around? And you’d see a lot of them everywhere. And it’s just because your awareness level has gone up a touch because you’re now in that car. And it’s not that everyone’s all of a sudden gone out, Sammie’s bought a red golf, I want a red golf. You just your awareness level’s gone up. And I think once you bring that awareness level to your finances, you’ll see little things. And yes, you know, like cutting out your cost of coffee and all the rest of it in the grand scheme of things isn’t going to mack makes a massive difference long term. But if you’re starting at ground zero, they’re big milestones. And having that awareness will just start to kind of like when you’re out for having somewhere to eat, or do we need to go to this restaurant, or is that one just as good? Do I need to go for a night out two, three times a month? Do whatever it might be, that little level of awareness makes a massive difference. The stuff that you guys do on gains, like that, the um the rewards and all that, like they mount up. Yeah, they’re not small numbers over a 40-50 year working life. Everybody say, Wow, fuck it, I’ll start tomorrow. But like, tomorrow’s gonna be like I’m 46 now, mate. Like, and life just goes like that. Like, we’re I mean, whenever this goes out, it’s Christmas two minutes ago. Like me and I misses went off for a walk last night. I was like, it’s it’s gonna be Christmas again soon. I’m just like, shut up.

[48:38] Sammie: Yeah, it’s nuts, isn’t it? I didn’t get, I was like, I was literally yesterday going, like, have I gotta start thinking about Christmas content soon. I’m like, Jesus Christ, mate.

[48:46] Ian: Like, I I worry about when I get to like that maybe 60s and 70s, how much quicker it’s gonna be then?

[48:51] Sammie: That’s scary.

[48:52] Ian: And like, like it’s it’s a real like sometimes wakes me up in the middle of the night kind of thing.

[48:57] Sammie: I was like, yesterday, have I made the most of it this summer? It’s like, have I? And I was like, yeah, you have. I was like, you take a step back, yes, you have. And I’m off to to France and uh and a few other places before the end of the year. Like I haven’t been away since like the middle of last year. And uh I was like, Yeah, you have by the end of that as well, you’ve like that’s a pretty good year. So like chill out a second, but then it made me think, like, because the last summer I had the regret, like I didn’t I didn’t nail the summer because we were like building the app and we were just like head down 16 hours, da da da go, go, go, go, go. And I didn’t make the most of last year, and I regretted that. So I was like, not gonna happen this year. So I had to sit back and ask myself, like, yeah, because it’s fast, it’s rapid. Yeah. Um, but I think you always take a step back and just think, like, am I making the most of this right now? And if you’re not, what can you do this next month to make sure you feel like you are? Because being fulfilled is massively important, yeah. So it’s saving for future, but life is now as well.

[49:57] Ian: Especially like if you’re a parent. Like, I can remember my kids being born like it was yesterday, like and the oldest one’s 21, the youngest one’s 19. He’s in America, oldest one’s in America for three months, youngest one’s gonna live in Newcastle and work up there. And it absolutely fucking broke me. And it broke me, not because they were moving out, I’m just like, I just want to have them like on my knee and play like a silly little game or go and play FIFA with them or go and do some of the other stuff. But like after those first few days of them being away, I’m kind of like, Yeah, do you know? I’ve done a good job, I’ve done all right. The kids have done, they’re they’re gonna get be they’re good people, they’re happy. If they’re in if they’re in difficulty, they’ll pick the phone up, you know, and I and it but it doesn’t help slow time down. If anything that’s sped it up even more, and I’m like, and the other horse said to me then she’s the next time we hold a baby, it’s gonna be one of our grandkids who’s gonna mean something to us. I’m like, fuck off, grandkids, but it’s true though, you know, and and like every now and again we’ll have those moments, and I’m like, wow, and it it’s gonna that’s exactly what’s gonna happen.

[51:02] Sammie: Yeah, life crazy, yeah. Um mate, I’ve loved this. Where do you want to send people today?

[51:08] Ian: Um, just check me out on Instagram. I’m ID the money man on LinkedIn at Ian Dempsey, come and find me. Like, don’t have a website, follow me content. I’ll talk about all the stuff we’ve talked about today.

[51:19] Sammie: Yeah, I loved it, man. Appreciate you as always. And uh yeah, we’ll 100% get you back on soon in the future. Thank you. Cheers, brother.